Open Source Game development?

    Hello everyone!

    I didn't know where to post this, since there isn't specific Game development (or whatever) category, so I posted it in here.

    I had a discussion with some open source game developers, which was initially about if open source games are actually targeting lower end hardware, since newer, commercial games need more and more resources, then turned into a discussion about what is actually crucial in game development, what are doing the FOS (free/open source) gamedevs wrong and so on. I stated, that FOS gamedevelopers especially ignore the needs of artists, since there are no decent FOS game engines/toolchains in my opinion.

    Now, I'd like to know your relation and experience with free/open source software and especially games. Do you use free software? How's your opinion on free software? But the main question is: Did you ever contribute to a open source game? Or have you used an open source game engine before?

    Now, to explain what open source games actually are...

    They appear in lots of different forms. But their main aspect is, that their code and all their art assets, such as maps, models, textures, sounds and so on, are freely available. That means that everyone is allowed to use those assets in his project, edit them as he likes and redistribute them in every form - as long as he redistributes with the same licensing terms (CC-by-SA, GPL). That's the basic philosophy of free software.

    The organisation can differ from project to project. Some projects keep their development closed and release everything when they're done (pretty much like a mod team). Others keep in touch with the community by making specific stuff (like the game design doc or the codebase) public, but still having the main development closed until release. The most common way of "organisation" is a very open model. There's a TODO-list, SVN, and probably a style quide and a design document. And everyone who's able to and wants to contribute can do that.

    Discuss.

    Quote from Psycho

    So, it's like Google Sketchup but the same principle has been applied to an open-source engine?

    Well, I think so... though I don't exactly know what Google Sketchup has to do with open source? :S

    FOS game development suffers from two primary problems: 1) ego and 2) audience.

    When I say ego, I'm not saying it in a bad way. But the truth is developers have egos. Artists take pride in their work, and talented artists and designers are a premium, so they the good ones aren't going to just hand everything away. The lower ones will, but then you get a lower quality end result.

    Audience is the second problem. There simply isn't a large audience. The most plays FOS games are played less than a lot of mods. You have to go our of your way to find them or know about them. Mods have an inherent tie to a commercial game's pre-built mindshare.

    I'm not ragging on FOS games. They're just an extremely small niche, more popular with coders than artists and players.

    The open source project I'm part of (Hero of Allacrost) has had some pretty good success thus far. Thankfully our artists are pretty good, and our lead artist isn't fond of those that asked to get paid for their art.

    As for audience, the game is designed to run on Windows, Linux and OSX, and due to the small number of games for Linux, we have a lot of support from the Linux community.

    IMHO, open source works great for workstation and everyday apps (I use FOS programs for everyday apps because its gives me a sort of guarantee that it is not spyware/bloatware), but I don't think it could work for entire video games. Components of the game engine (renderer, physics, plugins, etc), but as for the entire game being FOS, I don't think it works very well.

    The best place FOS has in the video game industry is in engine plugins/libraries (sdl, openGL, openAL, freeGLUT, etc), but not the entire game itself. At least not a game that would be up to par with todays gameplay standards. Something like Pong, yeah, open source, but something like Crysis, never.

    Quote from Section_Ei8ht

    IMHO, open source works great for workstation and everyday apps (I use FOS programs for everyday apps because its gives me a sort of guarantee that it is not spyware/bloatware), but I don't think it could work for entire video games.

    Extremely good point. A lot of it comes from the fact that the FOS community is coder driven. When you're a coder working for some academic institution or engineering company and you need a small widget or app for your work, you can usually combine efforts with similar coders and create a FOS solution for a communal problem, usually for a small-scale community. That's the primate reason FOS works. The target community is usually also contributing community. FOS games don't share that efficiency as their target is dmuch wider than their contributing source.

    Quote from Fletch

    Audience is the second problem. There simply isn't a large audience. The most plays FOS games are played less than a lot of mods.

    Tremulous disagrees.

    (oa/nex/bzflag/wesnoth also)

    Having a totally FOS game widens the audience potential more than a hl2 mod can. You just gotta make it not suck

    Quote

    Audience is the second problem. There simply isn't a large audience.

    That's partially true. Sure, mods do gain popularity through the initial game community. But since a FOS game doesn't need to run with a commercial game, plus it's free, a FOS game would theoretically have a bigger audience than a mod. You just need to know how to advertise your game, and how to make a good and funny game (as leilei said). The main problem here is in my opinion, that most FOS games are clones of other games, or simply haven't got a clear and decent organisation and game design.

    Quote

    - I wanted to contribute to the Quake 3 Remapping Scene (XReal) but a) theyr build sucked balls and b) theyr editiors and documents where not accesable on one click.

    Not only that. Quake3's mapping tools are the horror. A huge pain in the ass. And neither Tr3b nor someone else have tried to change that in the past 2-3 years (when Q3 was GPL'd and stuff). That's a big problem in FOS game development imho. Most tools are simply outdated or aren't well programmed or aren't well designed (or a mix of those).

    Quote

    Components of the game engine (renderer, physics, plugins, etc), but as for the entire game being FOS, I don't think it works very well.

    Hey, leave us dreaming

    Quote

    The target community is usually also contributing community. FOS games don't share that efficiency as their target is dmuch wider than their contributing source.

    That's why, in my opinion, free games should encourage artists, and of course other people, too, as much as they can.

    Quote from Steppenwolf

    What are actual succesfull open source games? I have no knowledge about this scene.

    none. if there were any successful ones we'd have known.

    Quote from Sindwiller

    Its content is mixed. It has has unfree and GPL stuff (for example the OpenQuartz content).

    But this *is* black and white - Planeshift and Warsow and Sauerbraten on the dark side, everything with completely Free content on the bright side.

    Yeah those are bad examples, but things get encouraging once you check out the server lists.

    The main thing why no 'pro' artist ever contributes to FOSS game projects is that their holy art will be MODIFIED!!! and BUTCHERED!!! and DAMAGING TO THEIR EGO!!! Plus they can't really make their portfolio level artwork then release it to some game because it'll totally be derived from.

    At least Chris Holden was generous and nice enough to contribute 60 new textures to OA at the start and knew my mission

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