The faces of Muhammad

Quote from Kosmo

So what if it happened in Death Star?

It means it happened in Denmark, in a western culture. Freedom of speech IS western culture. Where is their respect for it? If they want to live here they gotta respect it. Doesnt mean they gotta like it, but at least follow our laws.

Quote from RD

It means it happened in Denmark, in a western culture. Freedom of speech IS western culture. Where is their respect for it? If they want to live here they gotta respect it.

Its not the local Muslims that react so bad and burn flags, its the ones in the middle east. Its not just in Denmark, its in Norway aswell.So RD; Lesson 1:

The muslims that are pissed do not live in Denmark, they live in their "original" country in the middle east.

Lesson 2: Its possible that Denmark export wares and such to the middle east, so that they can get cut of the Muslims foodchain (if you know what Im talking about).

Lesson 3: Western and middle-eastern cultures aren't the same, we accept different things, we hate different things.

Cultures in Middle-east and Asia are very very different from western cultures. As an extreme example I will use Japan, because it is the culture I know best. Honor is everything to these people, they don't go around shouting and badmouthing people like we do, it's our culture, they don't like it, they don't watch Ozbornes. But when we took piece of their culture and made mockery out of it - that is typical to our culture, you don't understand it, mock it - and we literally showed our way of thinking down their throats.

This is the prime example of how annoying it is when people who don't know shit about you, your country or your culture come and tell you what is right and tell you how to live and how your ideas are wrong and all that shit.

We should not mess with them, not even when it is matter of "freedom of speech".

back on topic, this is about the drawings not Japan or ww2.

Drawing a cartoon in your own papers is not shoving our culture down the ME throat. You know what is? Emigrating from the ME to Denmark and demanding all this shit

Ok RD this is starting to make my head hurt.

You sure know how to handle entitys, but you sure as hell don't know what this is about.

Japan was used as an example, a mighty good example if you ask me, cause Kosmo told you about how their think of honour and how they threat themselves different than we threat ourself in the western part of the world.

Its nothing about the imigrants in Denmark, NOTHING. Most people here in Norway (Muslims, ME and such. And YES we are involved in the case) doesn't even care about the threats, but they say that they disrespected their holy stuff and such, but they don't put jihad on their ass cause they know the western culture by now.

Now, the thing about these drawings:

Some guys (12 artists) made 1 drawing each (I explained in another post), and they got printed some time ago. And when the ME people found out, they got pissed. Cause the drawings dis-respected their holyness and violated their rules about images and pictures (which I also posted in another post).

Now; What the discussion is about is this: Did the artists\directors do the right thing by making\printing them? Did they really dis-respect the ME people by going it (even if it wasn't their intention) and what are they going to do about it now?

Quote from st0lve

Ok RD this is starting to make my head hurt.You sure know how to handle entitys, but you sure as hell don't know what this is about.

I am flattered by your gentle tongue

Quote

Its nothing about the imigrants in Denmark, NOTHING. Most people here in Norway (Muslims, ME and such. And YES we are involved in the case) doesn't even care about the threats, but they say that they disrespected their holy stuff and such, but they don't put jihad on their ass cause they know the western culture by now.

I guess you havent yet experienced it, but its mortally lethal to ridicule Islam, even in many western countries such as Holland. Ofcourse this is just a tiny group of fruitcakes going around killing ppl, but it is a problem.

Quote

Now, the thing about these drawings:Some guys (12 artists) made 1 drawing each (I explained in another post), and they got printed some time ago. And when the ME people found out, they got pissed. Cause the drawings dis-respected their holyness and violated their rules about images and pictures (which I also posted in another post).

Now; What the discussion is about is this: Did the artists\directors do the right thing by making\printing them? Did they really dis-respect the ME people by going it (even if it wasn't their intention) and what are they going to do about it now?

Ofcourse they did the right thing, they made a drawing, had an opinion and printed it. They dont have to follow middle eastern islamic rules, they live in Denmark and theyre probably atheists

RD, respect is the problem, the western artists don't respect Islam, the Muslims don't respect laws.

I agree with you 100% that freedom of speech is very important. But Denmark, Holland and many other European countries decided to take in people from all religions and all cultures, where is their tolerance? Or don't Muslims count as people?

Just today there was in radio that some czech or other baltian beer company was using Jesus in ther commercials and the goverment banned the commercial, is it right? Hell no, but is it worth it to piss off people? Hell no!

I would say, that at this time and age, you would be wise to stay off of religious parody. Just a hint, since crazy fuckers are aiming missiles at each others, and I'm not just talking about USA/Europe vs. Middle-East situation, things aren't so great on the Pakistan-India axel either, not to mention Israel situation.

And the not so distant Paris riot just shows that things are going to get steamy in our own turf too, so we don't need fuckers like the cartoonist to spice the soup up. Since it's not just Muslims that cause problem, if you think back, you might notice that there has been some rumblings in Ireland too.

Quote from Kosmo

I would say, that at this time and age, you would be wise to stay off of religious parody. Just a hint, since crazy fuckers are aiming missiles at each others, and I'm not just talking about USA/Europe vs. Middle-East situation, things aren't so great on the Pakistan-India axel either, not to mention Israel situation.

If you dont confront it, and keep apologizing just because your tired of their shit, youll never get it over with.

Anyways, now also the germans, french, dutch, spanish and italian papers have republished the cartoons and added a new one:

Quote

The front page of the daily France Soir on Wednesday carried the headline "Yes, We Have the Right to Caricature God" and a cartoon of Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim and Christian gods floating on a cloud. Inside, the paper reran the drawings.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4670370.stm

Theyre being owned by freedom

Those fucking islamo fascists pissing me off. We are no muslims and we dont life in their countrys so we are allowed to draw as many pics of muhammad as we want. They should accept that.

how about some arab paper cartoons?

http://%7boption%7d

Quote from Steppenwolf

Those fucking islamo fascists pissing me off. We are no muslims and we dont life in their countrys so we are allowed to draw as many pics of muhammad as we want. They should accept that.how about some arab paper cartoons?

http://%7boption%7d

And them being assholes makes it okay! Cool, I love your logic! *thumbs up*

Quote from Steppenwolf

Those fucking islamo fascists pissing me off. We are no muslims and we dont life in their countrys so we are allowed to draw as many pics of muhammad as we want. They should accept that.how about some arab paper cartoons?

http://%7boption%7d

QFT

Quote from Kosmo

RD, respect is the problem, the western artists don't respect Islam, the Muslims don't respect laws.

They probably respect islam as a religion, but the whole thing about using muhammed in drawings was probably to point out the fact that they were using their religion for a war, which in turn shows that all they ment was that they dont respect Islam (yes, their own religion).

Quote

I agree with you 100% that freedom of speech is very important. But Denmark, Holland and many other European countries decided to take in people from all religions and all cultures, where is their tolerance? Or don't Muslims count as people?

We decided to take them in, yes.. But does that mean we gotta follow their rules? wheres their tolerance?

Quote

I would say, that at this time and age, you would be wise to stay off of religious parody. Just a hint, since crazy fuckers are aiming missiles at each others, and I'm not just talking about USA/Europe vs. Middle-East situation, things aren't so great on the Pakistan-India axel either, not to mention Israel situation.

Just think of what you said here, journalists should be afraid to put their opinions in the newspapers? WW2 anyone? You act like you just want to dig a hole and hide from everything.

Quote from RD

If you dont confront it, and keep apologizing just because your tired of their shit, youll never get it over with.

Anyways, now also the germans, french, dutch, spanish and italian papers have republished the cartoons and added a new one:

The front page of the daily France Soir on Wednesday carried the headline "Yes, We Have the Right to Caricature God" and a cartoon of Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim and Christian gods floating on a cloud. Inside, the paper reran the drawings.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4670370.stm

Theyre being owned by freedom

I don't mean that we should apologize or live by their rules, everybody are going to some stupid extremes. How does "respect your fellow man" suddenly turn in to "live by their rules"?

I actually like the god idea, but it's very different, Muslims were angry because some racist bitch make every Muslim look like a terrorist, he drew a picture that portrayed the whole Islam as a religion of terror and violence. I happen to know a Muslim, and he is an intelligent pacifist, he doesn't accept any of the things Muslims pull "in the name of Allah" but he didn't like the religious satire either.

Quote from Skjalg

They probably respect islam as a religion, but the whole thing about using muhammed in drawings was probably to point out the fact that they were using their religion for a war, which in turn shows that all they ment was that they dont respect Islam (yes, their own religion).

And you state this as a fact?

Quote from Skjalg

We decided to take them in, yes.. But does that mean we gotta follow their rules? wheres their tolerance?

Again, how does respecting their religion and culture turns in to "following their rules", soon you will be telling me that "I'm either with you or against you".

Weird extremes.

Quote from Skjalg

Just think of what you said here, journalists should be afraid to put their opinions in the newspapers? WW2 anyone? You act like you just want to dig a hole and hide from everything.

I'm not saying they shouldn't put their opinions in to newspapers, I just would like them to consider if it is so smart to mock other religions just to sell papers.

The Paris riots started from nothing, so the religious tension is very very high, anything can set the flames.

My last gf was a muslim and she was a totally normal person (as much as that's possible with women anyway)...

The drawings were indeed disrespectful towards Islam and muslim people but if you take a look at what kind of shit is going through the papers in the middle east and what kind of hatred and flag and jesus-cross burning is going on over there I really don't think they have a right to bitch about this anymore than we do. Just look at the link Steppenwolf posted... Says it all really.

I find it funny how people are like "Muslims are crazy, they pronounce jihad for almost nothing and threaten our lifes and noise like that".

We (Europe, USA and friends) are currently having troops in their countries, and there is no insurance if it will end before every single country in the Middle-east is under our rule (by puppet goverments), the threat of the nuclear nation allstars attacking some country is real in Middle-east, it's a genuine threat.

And people are wondering why they are pissed at us?

This is only my atheistic opinion but why would someone get pissed off, when a person makes fun of an imaginary person like Mohammed or Jesus? Geez this religion stuff, has anything good ever come out of it?

Fanaticism is bad.

Quote from Kosmo

They probably respect islam as a religion, but the whole thing about using muhammed in drawings was probably to point out the fact that they were using their religion for a war, which in turn shows that all they ment was that they dont respect Islam (yes, their own religion).

And you state this as a fact?

I said probably.

Quote from Kosmo

We decided to take them in, yes.. But does that mean we gotta follow their rules? wheres their tolerance?

Again, how does respecting their religion and culture turns in to "following their rules", soon you will be telling me that "I'm either with you or against you".

Weird extremes.

If you didnt know, this whole thing started because according to islam, its Illegal to draw Muhammed. Apperantly we broke a law, and should be punished for it.

And yes, either you're actually sympathizing with the crossburning hypocrits or you're not The time where the whole world might have to choose sides might come because of this.

another thing is that "they" wont understand how the danish country works, we have a democrati, and the freedom of speach.

"They" whant our "president" to give a apologi, its not something he can do couse i cant effect the content newspappers publish, but "they" wont understand that, now "they" whant a apologie from the Queen, she has nothing to do with it, and "they" wont understand that either, the newspapper jyllandposten have given the apologie.

i think its kind lame.

Just because your in theory allowed to say, draw, paint etc. anything you want, doesn't mean its ok for others. I wouldn't do shit if I think its ok, but I know that so many people will be pissed off, cause its a word called "respect".

We broke one of the Islams most important rules by publishing those pictures.

And we all know how the Muslims and Islamic people react when someone goes up agaist their belives, even I, who haven't been interessted in politics for more than a year knows that burning flags, threats and suchs is a "common" thing in the middle east.

Those drawings insulted millions of Muslims all over the world, as for now, the Swedes are the only smart people left in Scandinavia, cause they had enough knowlegde in their head NOT to print those pictures just because their allowed to do it.

I'm ashamed to be Norwegian these days.