I see you guys both point of views, and they're both valid. Mine was more what they can still do at this late stage, before they release this thing. Going back and changing level design and architecture design at this point, is pretty much an impossibility for them. And btw, i don't think simple boxy like levels can't be interesting, I mean that's what the first Doom and Quake games, or others like Heretic were based on, and they still felt good, i'd actually argue it helped them feel "otherworldly", it's part of the appeal that the architecture looks kinda out there. SS1 is just a bit samey, like same color palette, same ceiling heights, same corridors widths, shit like that... It's possible they just wanted this Remake to feel closer to the original and less of a revamp like RE2 and RE3 remakes.
System Shock Remake
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Doom 1 wasn’t that boxy IMO. They had corridors that went diagonally! ?
Quote from ┌HP┘7 hours ago, ┌HP┘ said: I see you guys both point of views, and they're both valid. Mine was more what they can still do at this late stage, before they release this thing. Going back and changing level design and architecture design at this point, is pretty much an impossibility for them.
True.
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Basically what we are saying is we should be in charge of art and map direction because we are professional arcmhair critics that also work in the gamez.
[Blocked Image: https://media.giphy.com/media/88iYsvbegSUn9bSTF8/giphy.gif]
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I think what they're doing is pretty solid for their first 'not a re-release' project. Could have better art direction but consider it's also pretty tricky game to redo without a massive budget and/or straying from the original too much.
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Quote from dux
2 hours ago, dux said: Basically what we are saying is we should be in charge of art and map direction because we are professional arcmhair critics that also work in the gamez.
[Blocked Image: https://media.giphy.com/media/88iYsvbegSUn9bSTF8/giphy.gif]
Having the MapCore shit posting crew tear your game apart would be my first move if I wanted to improve my game. And, if I wasn’t one of the shit posters…
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That second screenshot gives me hope that it won't be just one samey looking thing for the entire game.
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Quote from Buddy
2 hours ago, Buddy said: That second screenshot gives me hope that it won't be just one samey looking thing for the entire game.
You're absolutely right.
The iconic blue-orange sci-fi lighting in the first pic is awesome and recognizable as system shock but can become tiresome if it's just level after level of the same lighting.
Hopefully they will vary geometry and lighting across the space station.
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Looks awful imo
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Every ceiling looks so low, it's like moving in air ducts all the time.
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Quote from blackdog
On 12/16/2021 at 12:31 AM, blackdog said: Every ceiling looks so low, it's like moving in air ducts all the time.
That's what System Shock 1 is
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Quote from blackdog
On 12/16/2021 at 1:31 AM, blackdog said: Every ceiling looks so low, it's like moving in air ducts all the time.
As buddy said, this has always been the case
here are a few direct comparison shots between the original in 1994 and the remake in 2021/2:
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock15.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr11.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock16.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr8.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock14.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr10.jpg]
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@Buddy@will2kyeah but I would imagine part of that was technical restrictions. Wolfenstein 3D had same height ceilings all over, that didn’t stop them to open up the environments when they remade the games.
Now I haven’t played SS (I think i tried a demo from a shareware CD) so I don’t know if this is any part of the story, but I would doubt it?
In any case it might have been charming in the 90s but doesn’t seem to work right now, when there’s a bunch of detail right in your face. I think it’s part of the reason why it’s getting such mixed feedback
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Quote from blackdog
15 hours ago, blackdog said: @Buddy@will2kyeah but I would imagine part of that was technical restrictions. Wolfenstein 3D had same height ceilings all over, that didn’t stop them to open up the environments when they remade the games.
Now I haven’t played SS (I think i tried a demo from a shareware CD) so I don’t know if this is any part of the story, but I would doubt it?
In any case it might have been charming in the 90s but doesn’t seem to work right now, when there’s a bunch of detail right in your face. I think it’s part of the reason why it’s getting such mixed feedback
I agree with this notion as well though it seems that had they decided to reimagine it beyond these limitations the project would balloon out of control (and it was already troubled enough as it is).
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It's supposed to be cramped. It's on a space station. It's an action/rpg/horror. It's called System Shock.
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Quote from will2kDisplay More
On 12/17/2021 at 12:47 PM, will2k said: As buddy said, this has always been the case
here are a few direct comparison shots between the original in 1994 and the remake in 2021/2:
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock15.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr11.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock16.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr8.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/shock14.jpg]
[Blocked Image: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/jun/sr10.jpg]
you can blame budget but this just feels low effort. something like black mesa did the remake concept much better from a geometric standpoint and no one even got paid for that work up front.
on the other hand, plenty of good games have had mediocre or even bad presentation, so this could still be a lot of fun. I never made it far in the original because it was too dated by the time I got my hands on it
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This is just the straight up graphical upgrade down to the forms and textures of the assets. What more could you expect other than perhaps better lighting?
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…interesting geometry? I see the same thirty polygon wall-slot asset in every screenshot. Virtually any random sci-fi environment on art station looks more inspired
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Imagine telling the artists "remake all the textures from the original game but with models and high res PBR shading." And later when it's done be like, "damn, that's so derivative, you slack-off!".
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Quote from NikiOo
2 hours ago, NikiOo said: Imagine telling the artists "remake all the textures from the original game but with models and high res PBR shading." And later when it's done be like, "damn, that's so derivative, you slack-off!".
It’s also possible they don’t have very good environment artists. Plenty of people could make cooler stuff with similar restrictions. If you’re going to do a purely cosmetic remake, the cosmetics are important.
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