Reddit CSGO Wingman Map Contest

    Hey, haven’t seen anyone talking about this but some ten days ago I saw this popping up on Twitter. It could be an incentive to work on a 2v2 Map.

    I hope Valve will include community Wingman maps in the next operation, initiatives like this could help

    Unfortunately if you have already released your map you can’t enter, it’s a shame for those who recently put some effort in this category (I think the premise of the tournament is a bit off, since I’ve actually seen a lot of maps being developed – considering the average CSGO player won’t be able to play them)

    More focus on Wingman maps could be great for the mapping community. you can get away with more 'crazy' designs and they are much quicker to art.

    Good remedy when DE/CS maps are now taking a year+ to do to a high standard.

    I hope Valve is seriously considering a 50-50 split and attention for Wingman in the next Operation (or whatever will be). I think it would be great to get more people playing it, community can do a great job and ultimately with a decent pool of original maps, I would love to see pro 2v2 matches.

    Contests like this could be fundamental in achieving this objective.

    Wingman is a really cool idea that allows for lots of interesting layouts. However, I have discovered that almost every wm map is CT sided to some degree. I'm not just talking about shortdust, cobblestone, etc. because those are a joke since they are extracted from de maps. I have an idea that might make wingman a little more T sided: a map where CT's only arrive one second earlier than T's. Almost like shortdust except they had a guaranteed plant if someone covered left side and you smoke site. Anyway I am excited to see how people will implement balance into their wm levels. (For me the exception is rialto as it has creative checks and balances for both teams apart from the idiotic spawn kill :P)

    Yeah Rialto is surprisingly fun, I disliked it when I first saw it, but after a while, its simplicity works. I also really like how WM Inferno works. I think Lake works as well, thanks for the original design for 1 bombsite and is really fun giving the option to snipe/go round outside, or play mind games opening and closing doors in the house. Makes me think that Insertion would work well for the mode.

    Maybe Wingman outta steer off the bomb concept? Planting happens rarely, and I've played with players who told me not to plant and just go for the kills. Seems like planting is more a baiting mechanism, whether in Competitive is much more relevant.

    Another thing I like of Wingman is that using lesser weapons than the standard AR/sniper seems the best thing to do, due to smaller environments and the very easy turn on economy. Like @FMPONE was saying in his stream, the economy in the CS_ mode seems broken, maybe is not right for Wingman as well.

    Quote from blackdog

    4 hours ago, blackdog said: Yeah Rialto is surprisingly fun, I disliked it when I first saw it, but after a while, its simplicity works. I also really like how WM Inferno works. I think Lake works as well, thanks for the original design for 1 bombsite and is really fun giving the option to snipe/go round outside, or play mind games opening and closing doors in the house. Makes me think that Insertion would work well for the mode.

    Maybe Wingman outta steer off the bomb concept? Planting happens rarely, and I've played with players who told me not to plant and just go for the kills. Seems like planting is more a baiting mechanism, whether in Competitive is much more relevant.

    Another thing I like of Wingman is that using lesser weapons than the standard AR/sniper seems the best thing to do, due to smaller environments and the very easy turn on economy. Like @FMPONE was saying in his stream, the economy in the CS_ mode seems broken, maybe is not right for Wingman as well. 

    I have to disagree with you there, at least on the map part. Rialto is awful and not fun at all imo. So many spots where you can be as a CT, the path around the apartment seems useless. In addition, Inferno is the worst of the de_ maps turned wingman map. It is horrible as a T and the timings are just really unintuitive. In addition it has all of the problems that de_inferno has on A side.

    You are right about the bomb thing. Planting is very rare and not really useful. The economy is something that can be debated over, but it’s not perfect in wingman. Definitely better than in hostage.

    Not sure, I guess my judgment comes from my success on the maps.

    I most times had good experiences on Inferno, never heard before your post that A-site has problems… considering is most often the deciding map in pro tournaments ?

    Rialto is very unimaginative and clearly a repurposed bit scrapped from Canals, but I’ve manages to make it work, as well as getting a beating from amore capable Ts. I found the apartment to be a good option to mix things up from time to time against CT constantly playing same positions or pushing.

    For my experience, Nuke is the worst of all WM maps.

    Quote from blackdog

    2 minutes ago, blackdog said: Ye but what’s the problem?

    Pit? Apartments? Headshot angels. Crates on the side are just head peeks. Might be just me, but that’s not really fun to play

    Quote from Vaya

    9 hours ago, Vaya said: the timings are awkward due to the spawn points. they need to rework the bombsite for wingman imo

    Not sure, you meet at mid choke and if CT don't see them they go boiler and meet in apts as it happens in the full map? To me it looks natural given the layout. Not sure if you mean CT shouldn't spawn on bombsite, but there are many sites in the game that CT play "in front" of the site.

    Quote from T-Rexer

    9 hours ago, T-Rexer said: Pit? Apartments? Headshot angels. Crates on the side are just head peeks. Might be just me, but that’s not really fun to play

    Well yeah, it's a hard map for attacking Ts, that's for sure, both in de_ and wm_. Utility is very important to succeed. Trying to take the site from apts is scary and jumping out feels like a leap of faith; what I mean is that considering all these things you mentioned, the map plays well in WM for my experience... imo better than other maps, like Nuke.

    Not saying is perfect, just that for something cropped out of the main map, I find it to work surprisingly well. Of course I long for something designed on purpose ;) or I wouldn't have pimped the contest.

    Quote from blackdog

    3 hours ago, blackdog said: Not sure, you meet at mid choke and if CT don't see them they go boiler and meet in apts as it happens in the full map? To me it looks natural given the layout. Not sure if you mean CT shouldn't spawn on bombsite, but there are many sites in the game that CT play "in front" of the site.

    Well yeah, it's a hard map for attacking Ts, that's for sure, both in de_ and wm_. Utility is very important to succeed. Trying to take the site from apts is scary and jumping out feels like a leap of faith; what I mean is that considering all these things you mentioned, the map plays well in WM for my experience... imo better than other maps, like Nuke. 

    Not saying is perfect, just that for something cropped out of the main map, I find it to work surprisingly well. Of course I long for something designed on purpose ;) or I wouldn't have pimped the contest.

    Timings are not at all like the normal version.

    To Nuke, I have not played it a lot, but I was suprrised how well it plays with the reworks. Not perfect either, but at least for me way more enjoyable than inferno.

    Quote from T-Rexer

    5 hours ago, T-Rexer said: Timings are not at all like the normal version.

    To Nuke, I have not played it a lot, but I was suprrised how well it plays with the reworks. Not perfect either, but at least for me way more enjoyable than inferno.

    Well of course timings are not exactly like the full version, and I don't think they should. To me seems right that if T rush, CT see them one corner before. I like the way the brackets split and you can use utility to challenge or fake/disguise your movement.

    Whilst Nuke you spawn and you basically play inside the bombsite? Don't find that fun at all, especially with the vent opening changed. (That works in the full version.)

    Guess we have different taste :D

    Quote from blackdog

    2 hours ago, blackdog said: Well of course timings are not exactly like the full version, and I don't think they should. To me seems right that if T rush, CT see them one corner before. I like the way the brackets split and you can use utility to challenge or fake/disguise your movement. 

    Whilst Nuke you spawn and you basically play inside the bombsite? Don't find that fun at all, especially with the vent opening changed. (That works in the full version.)

    Guess we have different taste :D

    yea, our tastes seem to be quite different

    I think the nuke wingman map plays well. Just enough paths and options. Timings are pretty good too. CT has low cover on site which force them to push or stay back. This creates some, nice dynamic and giving T enough possibility to plant the bomb.

    I also like the Overpass one, but its abit hard for Ts. Really hating the canal map tbh.

    It would be nice to see a map/scenario where Ts might reach the site first but having a risky plantzone, so they are forced to use grenades and clear the area before they get a safe plant. CT might get a detour/risky route that takes some time to get in a good position for the aftherplant. So they can choose to prevent the plant by holding angles or push arround

    Quote from blackdog

    3 hours ago, blackdog said: Make Station that map! ?

    Sorry we didn't manage to play it, leaving for holiday in an hour

    I will create it afther station ;) enjoy your holiday mate, one day we will get to play station :D

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