de_dawn [WIP] and lots of newbie questions

    Hello Mapcore, after months of reading on mapcore, i signed up today and wanted to present my first 5v5 map in early Greybox Stage.

    It had worked fine before, but then i screwed something up. :P

    After compiling, the whole Map was black, only the props and the skybox looked normal. I didnt change the lighting at all.

    As soon as i have fixed the Problem, Id like to present he map and get some Feedback.

    Lukas

    Im not sure what you mean, however, i didnt change it. The angle is 195, xyz is 0 165 0 and pitch is -55, if that is what you mean.

    Lukas

    I started completely from scratch as the old Layout had several flaws. Screenshots/download coming soon. (Is there an alternative to dropbox or uploading it to the workshop?)

    Because its in an super early stage, i dont even have both bombsites.. timings are off probably and too short too (8-10 seconds to the sites)

    But maybe ill upload it so you guys can give more feedback.

    EDIT: here it is

    dont be too harsh, but im open to any criticism!

    -You should build every brush using nodraw and then only the texture the sites you can see when in the map

    - take skybox and light_environment settings from this list - https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Counter-S…ensive_Sky_List - or copy the entities from an official map until you get the layout down

    - use these textures over the horrible orange ones. trust me.

    [Blocked Image: http://i.imgur.com/BcjTtgz.png]

    - when showing layouts you're better either posting the radar or a sketch of your planned layout over a off angle ingame shot. https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Creating_a_working_mini-map

    at least hide your hud and viewmodel for a better shot. - cl_drawhud 0 - r_drawviewmodel 0


    Any questions let me know :)

    Thank you a lot!

    This is my first ever map and i only watched a few tutorials, which didnt Cover nodraw and the textures. What do you think about the layout in General?

    I can upload the overview but it wont show the 'underpass' to the first site.

    Thanks, ill give it a go! I definitely need it.

    EDIT: Screenshot added, overview.

    What do you think?

    Ts reach:

    A(left) after 8 seconds,

    underpass to A: 8 seconds

    Mid to A: 6-7 seconds

    Mid peek: 5 seconds

    B long: 12 seconds

    Mid to B: 7 seconds

    Rotation times: 12 seconds for cts and Ts (Mid or ct), 20 seconds for Ts over T spawn

    Most of the routes to the bomsites are too short imo, any suggestions?

    Red: T, Blue:CT, orange: sniper duels in mid, yellow: rotations

    I've had a quick look at your map and have some remarks:

    Quote

    I don't know why you don't put something solid at the edges, cause players can easily fall of the map.

    Quote

    I guess this is going to be a bombsite. But the pit you made has only one exit ( unless you boost someone out) All the other entrances are one way drop downs.

    Quote

    This pathway looks a bit strange, it's a crouch jump, which makes passing through here rather tedious.

    Quote

    Maybe try to fix those kinda spots where you're able to see other pathways through nodraw.

    Other remarks:

    -Add some basics like a buyzone for each team and the bombspots just for gameplay purpose.

    thank you very much!

    You are completely right with your points, but the sites arent even close to a playable state.

    I am aware of that, both bombsites arent complete yet. On the left site i will add ladders or boxes to make it climbamble, and on the other there will be a "staircase" building that will add cover and hide the nodraw-spots.Ct spawn isnt even there yet, until now i only did the T-side of the map. what do you think about middle, and the pathways to the obsite on the left? Anything that could be OP or destroy gameplay?

    You can't say with any level of certainty what does and doesn't work without getting the map made first, everything is relative. You need to focus on finishing a draft of the map, then we can test it to help you find out. You're worrying about a lot of small details without having the large details present for them to matter.

    I would suggest the following in a rough order of importance:

    • Add bomb site triggers (first one you place is always A)
    • Make sure there are 20 spawns (10 for each team)
    • make sure your walls / floors are no thinner than 32units
      • unless you plan to make it penetrable
    • Don't bother with stairs for now, just make ramps so we can all get everywhere
    • At this stage less cover is better
      • It's easier to add cover to help than work out which of 1 million crates is hindering gameplay
    • select everything and apply nodraw
      • then using face edit tool (shift+A) reapply textures
    • Fix your light environment (I've taken it upon myself to choose one for you as it's "dawny")
      • try these values from de_lake (skybox name = "sky_cs15_daylight02_hdr"):
        • Ideal Sun Angle = 0 296 0
        • Ideal Sun Pitch = -30
        • Ideal Brightness = 247 232 202 600
        • Ideal Ambience = 172 196 202 250
          • (seriously, just some good lighting makes the map feel 100% better)
    • Add signs to the map and bombsites so we know where to go
    • Watch tutorial on how to make radar
    • Submit to mapcore for 10v10 play test

    I also made this introductory tutorial for a competition we hosted a while back. It's since been buried, but might be worth a quick read through to get to grips with some things:


    Hope this helps, good luck

    thanks a lot!

    i didnt bother to make the bomb zones, skybox etc. because the ct spawn area is missing competely.

    Regarding the walls, i want to make some walls in mid penetrateable to give the cts more power stopping a mid to A/B push (spamming those 16/8 unit walls). I will finish the bombsites and the layout next week because i spring break starts on monday and im busy with school now.

    What do you think about the timings? Is 8 seconds for a rush too short? Will it make the map too small?

    Quote from Vaya

    -You should build every brush using nodraw and then only the texture the sites you can see when in the map

    Done that in the past, fan of optimising things early, but in the end I found that it is a waste of time. Correct me if I'm wrong:

    * I find faster to work with the dev textures, select everything and either apply nodraw or deselect visible walls and apply nodraw

    * during blackout stage doesn't really matter, environment is so empty that performance isn't killed by not using nodraw everywhere

    * working on a map where all you can see is yellow is a pain, when you zoom out everything gets mushy and you can't tell a brush from the other

    so I don't see the benefits of using nodraw from my first brush or in a stage where you are continuously altering the foundations of the map. You simply enlarge, make longer or shorter a corridor and you have to re-texture, to maybe have to go back to the previous stage…

    Quote from blackdog

    Done that in the past, fan of optimising things early, but in the end I found that it is a waste of time. Correct me if I'm wrong:

    * I find faster to work with the dev textures, select everything and either apply nodraw or deselect visible walls and apply nodraw

    * during blackout stage doesn't really matter, environment is so empty that performance isn't killed by not using nodraw everywhere

    * working on a map where all you can see is yellow is a pain, when you zoom out everything gets mushy and you can't tell a brush from the other

    so I don't see the benefits of using nodraw from my first brush or in a stage where you are continuously altering the foundations of the map. You simply enlarge, make longer or shorter a corridor and you have to re-texture, to maybe have to go back to the previous stage…

    That's true! I've just got in the habit of doing it with nodraw and like it that way :P

    @blackdog & @Vaya if you work in flat-texture in the 3D view all brushes are coloured based on what they are: brushwork blue, func_details green etc. with marginally different colour values so you aren't overwhelmed by the flat nodraw yellow. Then you can face edit before compile.

    But, there's no right way (unless we've been missing out on something revolutionary?), just what we find comfortable :D

    I also find it easier to do it with dev textures and then nodraw the non visible areas afterwards. Any tips about size, timings etc? my maps always end up too big or too small/ too open or too wide.

Participate now!

Don’t have an account yet? Register yourself now and be a part of our community!

Register Yourself Login