De_tuscan beta discussion

?

it's one of the most famous custom map from CS 1.6 and CS:Source. The community have been waiting for its remake on GO for 3 years and it finally released.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/fi…s/?id=312199550

The main issue is that the textures are really sharp and ... ugly, i really don't like them. The lighting is buggy because there are 2 light_environments entities in the map but with different configurations (brightness, angles and pitch), so the lightmap calculated by RAD differs from the cascade shadows and crazy bugs happen, such as :

[Blocked Image: http://img110.xooimage.com/files/6/7/0/2014-09-10_00001-478e363.jpg]

I can't believe that after 2 - 3 years of work you can release a beta with this kind of "bug". Also the textures are most of the time applied badly and quickly, he really should have accepted all the help people have proposed him...

Quote from leplubodeslapin

I can't believe that after 2 - 3 years of work you can release a beta with this kind of "bug". Also the textures are most of the time applied badly and quickly, he really should have accepted all the help people have proposed him...

A million times yes. I don't know what his reasons were for keeping it locked down like he has, but it looks really dated. I'm also confused as to why he made it North African/Spanish, when the name already suggests another area of the world entirely.

[Blocked Image: http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/34097587308192570/E4DC0CCFD985B216FF82FED6A8C973C46654312A/637x358.resizedimage]

I don't want to sound bitchy but look at those boxes in this screenshot, I would expect something much more interesting and less flat. The short tree and excessive vegetation seems like a poor design choice as well.

http://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffens…nally_d/cke83gu

2 years

It looks like a bit of a mess going by the reddit discussion, lots of unintended jump spots and invisible walls. A Duke Nukem forever of a map

I can't help but feel sorry for brute- obviously he wants to keep full control of his creation but the community is pushing for the map (tuned to current standards) constantly. I guess it comes down to where your map stops being yours and starts being part of the communities furniture.

same time thou:

Quote

@K3nnyfr it's not about money. I've never mapped for money. I don't want someone like fmpone working on it.

https://twitter.com/BrutesMaps/status/509112216314843138

if it isn't about the money, what is it about?

I don't know about you guys but if I created an original map that was a huge success among the community I would gladly seek help or even let other people make a better version of it, if I can't deliver a solid remake.

unless you are greedy and don't want to share the potential operation money..

first thing that came to my mind when I walked around the map is 'this isn't really a competitive map'... way too much visual noise with dark/sharp textures and many spots with overdone foliage where you can't see players properly. and there are way too many jumpable boxes and spots (not counting the rooftop bugs)..

I'm sure that the people who made it into operations wouldn't mind give a little advise without demanding profit shares right away.. Judging by the feedback I see now, he hasn't done any notable playtesting or reviews by anyone whatsoever. I get that he doesn't want to let his baby go, but I am pretty confident that there's quite a number of people that could have pulled off a better job in the timespan he's taking.

That being said, it is 'advertised' as being a beta version, and the feedback he is getting is enormous, let's hope he makes the best of it and isn't shy to ask for help now that so many reached out.

Man this guy seems like a total fucking dick head. I personally dont enjoy Tuscan as a layout, but I respect people who do. Him working on it to make it better and re-release to CSGO is really cool and a responsible thing to do as an author of a fan favorite map. But for him to work on it for 3 years? and it to come out pretty mediocre and have so many bugs and issues, then when he defends himself+map about why its in this state, to lash out and call out FMPone, for what ever reason, is childish. He deliberately play tested with a very small focus group and never really publicized it for feedback.

I used to aspire to the old community map devs for CS, but this just is another case of dont meet your idols/heroes.

I think the FMPone comment was very unfair, not only to FMPone but to Volcano and Ted as well. It was a cheap shot without any obvious foundation in truth -- I don't think anybody who puts that much love in to their maps can only be doing it for the money. I'm assuming Brute's just on the defensive because there's been so much pressure from the community to release the map and now that it's out in some form the response has been ... mostly unhelpful.

Most of the comments on Reddit et al are just people smuggly pointing out self-boosts and poor clipping, which has got to be frustrating when I guess what he really needs is more insight in to issues such as visibility, layout, etc. Things that are actually going to effect the map once it's out of beta.

I had a run around in it earlier and found visibility of CTs to be an issue throughout, but this can be fixed by changing the CT skins and adding whitewashes etc. I think the visuals need some cleaning up and a bit of post-processing will probably tie it all together nicely in the final version. Overall I think my main issue is that he doesn't appear to have done any player leading with the visuals so anybody who hasn't played the map before will probably take a while to learn what spots they need to check and where to go etc.

Thematically speaking I hope he plans on replacing the tropical foliage with something a bit more Italian.

I'm looking forward to playing with some real people soon.

A pretty cheap shot comment by whoever the fuck that guy is towards pone, and I've certainly never heard of him. The funny thing is shawn would do twice as better a job without any motivation over money.

Quote from dux

The funny thing is shawn would do triple as better a job without any motivation over money. +only in 5 months instead of 2 years.

ftfy.

Let's not turn this into a shit show guys. If you wanna give feedback on the map give feedback, otherwise maybe we should close the thread.

Ive told him several Times that the Map looks bad and he should get some help. I got the same answer everytime: "Im Brute, Im know what Im doing, it will be played not matter how it looks". I was trying to give him some solid feedback and Stuff he could / had to change before releasing it to the public. But his ego was stronger than my arguments obviously.

-For me the Map looks like a basic Brushwork with some props attached to it. He has to change most of the buildings - especially the white / blue ones, they still -look some weird cs / cs:s surreal building.

-He has to work on the lighting and fix the cascade bugs all scattered around in the map.

-Clipping - obviously

-Rework most of the texture work he has done and check for blending player models. There are some places like mid and banana where the background is just too noisy

-get some archmodels, that arches have to be a joke (they were like the first thing i pointed out)

I dont like brute as a person, he was a inspriration to my at some point in the past. But with things like "No worries everyone has an opinion, it's hilarious that people still believe that I've worked on this project nonstop for 3 years when in reality it's only been about 8-9 months of on/off working on it." said, i cant find anything good at this guy (from his facebook page). The community wanted this map so badly, he said "I want to build it, noone else is allowed to!" and he teased them all for almost 3 years. Saying something like that afterwards just shows how immature he is and is a punch in everyones face who supported him and his work. Nuff said

How long (realistically) would it take to resolve all the issues with this version of the map?

Well, the map isn't that bad, but really not impressive, especially not after almost 3 years.

But he seems to be right when he says:

Quote from SirK

"Im Brute, I know what Im doing, it will be played not matter how it looks".

He got tons of subscribers and obviously good raitings (currently #6 top rated all time).

Sometimes I don't understand the community...

The workshop page needs a rework. my current de_season has 98k subs and solid ratings, yet is buried on the 2nd page.