Doom (4)

    "Two sources told me that earlier this year, frustrated with the lack of progress on Doom 4, ZeniMax came to Id with an ultimatum: make something happen, or else."This sounds bad

    At this point the right thing to do –to me– would be to stop working on this game and do something else for a while. I also would be curious to see what an external team would be able to do with the IP and a blank slate to work on; I fear that id is under an unbearable amount of pressure to make Doom happen, and I mean from their very own selves first and foremost. Then they face (enraged) fans and a (skeptical) publisher.

    I hope they can pull it off.

    Quote from Obsidian

    The real issue is that I think people who come to play an id Software game expect the game to be fast, filled with carnange, and brutally hard.

    This is us, we grew eating pizza and Doom, but let's make an headcount: how many can we be? We are a niche of the current market, and we unfortunately aren't as big as Bethesda's targets. Or whatever publisher for the matter.

    Quote from JeanPaul

    I have also heard from those who worked on it that compiling and getting things playable is a serious nightmare.

    Guess it is, they provided these kind of numbers

    Quote

    TYPICAL BUILD TIMES:* Initial map loads: 20–60 minutes

    * Load times after initial load: 1–3 minutes

    ...

    http://cdnstatic.bet...Kit Welcome.pdf

    who would want to work in these conditions

    Quote from blackdog

    This is us, we grew eating pizza and Doom, but let's make an headcount: how many can we be? We are a niche of the current market, and we unfortunately aren't as big as Bethesda's targets. Or whatever publisher for the matter.

    Yeah but then they should call it "Cool boyz perks shooter" and release as a new IP, and save the Doom sequel until the niche market is big enough instead of messing up Doom (more)

    I must clarify that when I'm writing that Doom 3 and Rage were/are bad, that's not because I think they are bad compared to, let's say HL2 or uh... I don't know, COD or whatever new there is. I'm constantly comparing new action games to action games around or before y2000, I'm doing so because I still play these games from time to time. I played through Quake 2 with expansions a couple months ago, it's still fun for me, last summer me and a friend played through the Blood campaign in coop - it was awesome.

    I'm really living in the past, it's like I'm still waiting for that Doom 2 sequel that never came.

    Quote from Obsidian

    The real issue is that I think people who come to play an id Software game expect the game to be fast, filled with carnange, and brutally hard. Recent id games are woefully missing the challenge and difficulty expected of them. If "Ultra-Violence" is too easy and "Nightmare" is even remotely possible to play, they're doing it wrong. They are also missing the labyrinth-like complex level design that were prevalent with earlier id titles. Early Doom and Quake titles didn't have a specific route that you were supposed to take, you were left on your own devices to explore the map and find your own way though dead ends and locked doors. But that type of gameplay conflicts with the cinematic type game which requires a certain level of linear gameplay. And that's why these new titles don't feel like an id game.

    What you just said. Are you by any chance the quake-obsidian?

    Quote from Hipshot

    What you just said. Are you by any chance the quake-obsidian?

    You recognized me. I will now have to use my ninja skills to track you down. Prepare to be hunted. (Yeah I lurk here sometimes)

    I remember the days when the name Doom sold itself. Now it needs a heavy marketing campaign to shove it's beta through people's throats. Are they really so insecure about the new Doom that they have to promote it like that? They probably are. Because let's face it, Id Software has made one game in 10 years and it was mediocre at best. The big names are long gone. Bethesda, should really just put the studio name to rest. It's long overdue. Put talented studios on the IP's. Studios that know how to get shit done instead of working half a decade on something apparently so bad it has to be rebooted.

    I can understand trying to put an investment to profit, and Doom is not like a saturated brand.

    What I can't understand is pushing a technology like Tech 5 that seems anachronistic to other projects like Dishonored, forcing the team to migrate to a totally different pipeline.

    That door sound.

    External Content www.youtube.com
    Content embedded from external sources will not be displayed without your consent.
    Through the activation of external content, you agree that personal data may be transferred to third party platforms. We have provided more information on this in our privacy policy.

    Couldn't sleep so I was thinking about this new Doom. They shouldn't have made it take place on earth. I know it's logical (Doom 3 was a remake of Doom 1 and this would be a remake of Doom 2: Hell on Earth). However, back in those days we didn't have the graphical power to accurately display earth in a game. So many games already take place on earth and I for one have a hard time imagining Doom on earth without losing that typical Doom feeling. Darksiders did it and although it was a great game, the earth sections we're definitively the weaker parts. Besides, as a sci-fi horror fan, I think it's a setting that's underused.


    Instead they should focus on what made Doom 2 great. It was more open, it had bigger fights and a larger scale overall. I really hope they don't try to mimic COD and stick to smooth run and gun gameplay with hordes of demons. No RPG stuff please. Also, they suck at doing story driven stuff. If I were them I would take a good look at Aliens and the Dead Space games for inspiration. Make it a sequel to Doom 3 and have it start with a marine battalion being sent to Mars to investigate the distress calls. Have it take place on the ruined UAC basis and hire a talented writer.


    For context I would start by focus on finding out what happened. After that, the focus should be on retrieving the gate that allows the demons to come through. You could make it that the marines have to retrieve that gate, get it on board of the ship so it can be shipped to a space station where scientist can figure out how to close it for good. Of course ending in sending you with the marines though and finish it off in Hell. This allows for a variation in settings (Mars, space ship and station (Dead Space) and Hell). I would have the game switch between moments you are alone (tension, horror) and moments you work with squads. This should help pacing. You could also use zero gravity for some awesome fights (again, Dead Space).


    Drop in and drop out coop would be a given. Have players team up against the demons. Also, full fledged multiplayer, including a horde modus and of course mod support (which is unlikely due to IdTech5 it's nature). Biggest selling point would be massive fights that aren't scripted. So you got big set pieces but not the COD kind. Destructible environment, secrets and no more monster closets. Also, well lit environments (let it make sense) and dark where it needs to be. No switching between flashlight and gun. No mandatory vehicle sections please unless it works in the game's advantage.


    That's what my Doom would be.

    I'm going to go ahead and say it, I know this might be a bad thing to do and may haunt me, megatextures are the worst possible feature in the history 3D engines. Not only is it the worst feature but it was also shoe horned into the worst possible environments to support the feature making it even more terrible. Ok done. off my chest now...


    I want to see how they go about building the new Doom as I feel really passionate about this topic. I feel like old school design has gotten a bad rap when it is absolutely viable and fun with solid level design. I see zero excuses for them to not pull this off IMHO.

    In the promo shots, Rage was looking like no other game before it, and the mega textures gave the unique look that Carmack always said wanted to achieve.

    Of course they're highly impractical and had too many trade offs on old consoles.

    I always wondered if it's a tech that could work for streaming directly online, and I mean stream the tiles instead of installing gigs of data.

    Quote from blackdog

    In the promo shots, Rage was looking like no other game before it, and the mega textures gave the unique look that Carmack always said wanted to achieve.

    Of course they're highly impractical and had too many trade offs on old consoles.

    I always wondered if it's a tech that could work for streaming directly online, and I mean stream the tiles instead of installing gigs of data.

    if it were streaming the textures, it would likely be even more compressed to compensate for most of the US's internet (And imagine it in Canada, where data caps are awful, apparently).

    Yeah, of course I'm talking about ideal conditions, like those you need for OnLive

    (And to be maybe used for lesser time response demanding applications, like displaying stuff in 3D on a webpage)

    Quote from Castle

    I'm going to go ahead and say it, I know this might be a bad thing to do and may haunt me, megatextures are the worst possible feature in the history 3D engines. Not only is it the worst feature but it was also shoe horned into the worst possible environments to support the feature making it even more terrible. Ok done. off my chest now...


    Have you played Wolfenstein?! The game looks absolutely awesome, sharp and the levels have a very handcrafted look to them because they can easily hide seams with stamps (decals) that later get baked into the textures, and they don't need to worry about resusage as much as we do. (At least not from the technical point of view)


    Rage was the very first game released with this tech, therefor it came out with it's fair share of problems, wolfenstein was just the first iteration and it's already looking amazing. Also, it's worth mentioning that Wolfenstein is also a PS3/Xbox360 game, imagine the next game that'll run on idtech5, it'll probably be next-gen only, materials will most likely have PBR and way more memory buffer to play around with.


    The ONLY fault of megatextures was because it was way ahead of it's time.

    It's more about constant loading and streaming, that ruins the immersion for me I wouldn't say megatextures are bad. I like the idea but it's just one from several ways to handle texture memory and speed loading. Many other engines can easily render beautiful levels without that tech so that pretty sums up what I think about megatextures...


    The game looks nice, it's not mind blowing, it's just OK and passes the standards.


    I think that hardware defines the tech and right now we have way more memory and way faster hard drives/RAM to use usual streamed content and megatextures is not needed so much as it was when we had less than 500MB of GFX memory.

    Megatextures have a lot to offer, it's just a matter of storage and tech at this point. I don't think any engine can bring the same thing, but they also bring a lot of issues. Bottom line is that you will never get the same result with another engine and they're super handy to use, whether if it's the best or the worst is a different story...

    (ok, I'm pretty drunk but I mean it, megatextures are cool!)

Participate now!

Don’t have an account yet? Register yourself now and be a part of our community!

Register Yourself Login