Do you enjoy your job in the games industry?

    If you find your job is not fulfilling enough you can try to pursue other interests in your free time, preferably things that have nothing to do with gaming and that you are passionate about. We have to remember that our media is very multidisciplinary by nature and you can't level up as an artist or designer if your only source of information/art is art station and polycount. You need to read books, you need to watch weird shit, you need to go out and observe the world around you.


    A while ago my skill level was reaching a plateau and I had no idea why. I would go home, start big projects and never go anywhere because making big projects, well, require huge amounts of energy. Then I'd get demotivated because I wasn't leveling up nor finishing anything, that feeling kept feeding on itself and at some point I just quit trying to make any environment art at home. At that time, I moved teams to a completely different project and art pipeline. It was pretty challenging but it forced me to go back into "research" mode at home which paid off insanely well. During that time I learned Zbrush properly, PBR, UE4, started drawing again, read a lot about arts, science, history etc.. I also reflected on what's my main motivation to be here and came to the conclusion that it wasn't GAMES themselves but creating immersive worlds. That's my real passion and what I always wanted to do. Games are currently the most accessible media for that since you can build stuff quickly and walk around your creations, but to me games are not the "end game" for my career but rather a means to an end.


    I'm extremely lucky to have the chance to work in a company that enables me to grow constantly so it's easier for me to "level up" during the day than it would be if I was making crappy IOS games or whatever. However, if that's not the case for you, you have to start challenging yourself since you are the only one responsible for your life. It's easy to get into grumpy mode and start blaming the company, the boss or the game for doing half-assed work, but you should really only blame yourself if that happens to you. I did this before when working on Nintendo DS games and will never do it again. You have the chance to work on fucking games instead of cleaning toilets so use that in favor of your own growth and not against it.


    What I'm trying to say is, if you are deluded with the games industry maybe the problem is not the industry itself but the way you think about your career and future. Maybe all you have to do is to realign your priorities. Maybe not. Only you can tell.


    By the way, this is not directed at anyone, I'm just putting into words what I think was doing wrong and what I think I'm doing right


    [Blocked Image: http://www.ushispanicministry.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/rnd-rudy.gif]

    lol goddam these jobs are too comfy to complain about and I don't even know what other jobs are like thats how first world I am.


    Unless you work for 4A making games in an ex-ussr internment camp basement gulag with wild dogs roaming your workspace or something.

    I think it's good to have a good moan every once and a while


    Minos, interesting read, cheers man! Totally agree on finding other stuff in life. Does make me wonder what you guys have been working on for the past however many years you've been at Blizzard!

    Just having the experience of being able to compare one creative job with another is a pretty good problem to have.


    I'm not trying to take the piss I just really wanted to make that 4A joke to be honest.

    There's one thing that didn't came out too often in this conversation though, at least for the job of an environment artist that is, the one i know. Is that the job requires more than often a lot of psychological endurance, because it can turn very repetitive when you are working within a company (even a great one).


    That's pretty much depending of where you work at, what is the project or how the work is managed between the env guys (if the dirty work is not dispatched equally between the team and it ends up being on you). But sometimes when things need to be done to hit release, they have to be done.


    For example i remember in Paris during the development of a crappy horse game doing the worst monkey job (nothing against monkeys) spending 8 months filling by hand kilometers of grass, trees and the like with broken tools and have to deal with the worst management ever (i mean i liked my job as a porter at the airport more). I saw all of my co-workers full of enthusiasm slowly breaking up, spending their day moaning a bit more and trying to leave the boat to more interesting teams within the studio or desperately working on making unique assets, turned up I ended alone to finish placing vegetation in my shiny armour (until the intern arrived). And that's the thing, they were right, because this inevitable dose of repetitive work is the real mind killer.


    I mean if everyone was working at a company like they do at home, nobody will be moaning and everything would be - c r e a t i v e - including unicorns, sparkling stars, and butterflies.


    And if you are unlucky and that's falling on you, that's where you need a good balanced personal life first (and cool coworkers), something to drive you like a passionate feeling about what you do or a self accomplishment feeling (like doing stuff at home) or a very hard psychological resilience, or move to somewhere else; otherwise you will have the feeling to live the same boring day again and again, you will burn out super fast and you will be totally disgusted by what you liked.


    I mean people can shit on IOS, small games etc, but sometimes i can be much more interesting than AAA games, especially if you are managing all the art direction since there's no one else to do it, and you can learn much more for yourself doing this than making repetitive content for an AAA.

    Beware Kokoz, the grass is always greener on the other side. The stories I've heard and some of the experiences I've had from iOS and general indie development have left me a less rose tinted impression of that part of the industry.


    But I think that's true about every type of job or industry - everyone has their own problems, and you'll have to wager which problems are easier or harder for you personally to solve. Something that is soul crushing to you may not be so to another, etc.. I guess if nothing else works out in neither part of what you love to do, you can always just go solo and attempt to try your own hand at your passion.

    Quote from KoKo5oVaR

    I saw all of my co-workers full of enthusiasm slowly breaking up, spending their day moaning a bit more and trying to leave the boat to more interesting teams within the studio or desperately working on making unique assets, turned up I ended alone to finish placing vegetation in my shiny armour (until the intern arrived). And that's the thing, they were right, because this inevitable dose of repetitive work is the real mind killer.


    Regardless of what industry you work in, interns are always fucked!

    Do you guys ever get any "moral" questioning* about working on games? I mean thinking that games are intrinsically addicting and for lot of kids is the only activity they do apart school.

    I know this is a problem is family related, but I think the question still stands.

    *i mean if you yourselves feel guilty at some degree. Mine it's not a question on education, I'm just thinking that lot of kids after school they just play instead of doing sports, petting animals, etc.

    It really depends on the game you are working on. Not all games are Call of Pooty, there are still very fun and educational games. They may not be educational in the typical way, but even schooling isn't the best educational structure.

    Quote from blackdog

    Do you guys ever get any "moral" questioning* about working on games? I mean thinking that games are intrinsically addicting and for lot of kids is the only activity they do apart school.

    I know this is a problem is family related, but I think the question still stands.

    *i mean if you yourselves feel guilty at some degree. Mine it's not a question on education, I'm just thinking that lot of kids after school they just play instead of doing sports, petting animals, etc.


    What? Absolutely not, I never even looked at it that way before! Sure, games can be addictive, but only people with addictive personalities will get hooked by games, if it weren't games it would be something else.


    cashed brought up "educational" games as a counter argument to that and while, sure, there's a few, no one really got hooked on "Learning English with a platformer game 101".

    Games offer immersive experiences and worlds, no other media can offer that, that's why I'm making games, to offer people the same pleasure I have when i play a really immersive (or even fun) game.


    People that say that games are dangerous and addictive are as ignorant as they come, kids back in the 80's were hooked on movies, in the 70's we're hooked on comics, kids back in the 60 were hooked on dodge ball (and LSD), and so on and so forth.


    So... no.


    https://sfglobe.com/?id=216&src=home_articlexpromo

    I don't entirely mean educational games as "here's a lesson". Games are pushing aspects into social lives which in itself can be a learning process for others or rehabilitation. How we interact in a game and such. Mass Effect does a bit with the Paragon system and its basic social aspects. Because we all know schmoozing Miranda works just like in real life.

    Quote from blackdog

    Do you guys ever get any "moral" questioning* about working on games? I mean thinking that games are intrinsically addicting and for lot of kids is the only activity they do apart school.


    It's a bit off-topic I guess, but I have found myself feeling this now and then.


    On one hand... why are games where you KILL PEOPLE fun? It makes me question all those movies I grew up watching, John Woo, Steven Seagal... why is shooting bad guys 'cool'? Maybe I shouldn't question it, I try not to, I read an interview where someone asked Tarantino about violence in his movies and he simply said "because it's more exciting."

    At least I've never worked on a game which is too close to real life, going to Afghanistan or Iraq and shooting Middle Eastern men.


    The other part of your question has also troubled me lately... I think the average game (I've worked on) is fine in terms of, if a kid didn't play that game, they would have watched a movie or read a book. It's just entertainment. But when you start padding your game out with collectibles, or introduce levelling systems it does trouble me. I enjoyed the Destiny beta, but was troubled by the end that I'd put 8 hours in and had stopped enjoying the second-to-second core combat but still wanted to play to gain XP or motes of light or whatever bullshit grindy thing they have, because it was quite addictive.

    I guess that's it; grinding is what I have a personal problem with, although I know it 'works', which is scary.

    Yes it is a bit off-topic, but still I think it falls in the arguments that might make you enjoy or not your job.

    I'm afraid my question hasn't been properly understood: it is not my intention to talk about schooling or addiction, just an observation, a point of view.

    Thanks Alf Life, you are hitting exactly on what I was thinking.


    Quote from (HP)

    What? Absolutely not, I never even looked at it that way before! Sure, games can be addictive, but only people with addictive personalities will get hooked by games, if it weren't games it would be something else.

    Just because you seem a bit defensive on this I want to clarify that I'm not making accusations of "games being bad"; of course addiction is a complex problem and the problem is in the person suffering from it, but I don't think you can make the judgment of saying that it would be someting else for sure. I probably mis-used the term, I'm not referring at serious conditions but to the condition of being "sucked in" and "one more time" that leads to half hour after half hour of more gaming. Which is very common i think... I very easily fall into that, and it wouldn't even be about grinding!

    Quote

    Games offer immersive experiences and worlds, no other media can offer that, that's why I'm making games, to offer people the same pleasure I have when i play a really immersive (or even fun) game.

    And I think this is great, and the reason why most game developers do what they do, and why lot of others want to join in the industry... definitely why I would like to work in it.My concern/annoyance is that lots of kids just do gaming, and it's not addiction and I don't think is even enjoying a game, but it feels like they are just consuming: the same way as if they were watching TV.


    Quote from Alf-Life

    It's a bit off-topic I guess, but I have found myself feeling this now and then.

    [...]

    Thanks again, you are touching on the arguments I was thinking. And i'm not criticising: i love shooters, that's what I play mostly, and sometime I wonder what physcological mechanism makes it fun.Then yeah, there's the infamous grinding and treadmill that became so popular in this generation and makes games real life suckers if you are not careful. For eg I didn't really like Assassin's Creed, but I couldn't help but collecting flags: the parkour mechanic was so fun that I really enjoyed exploring every corner of the cities. But then hated myself for wasting time on such a pointless thing.

    I want to add that I started asking myself these questions ages ago, when I had given up on the idea of being able of work in games and I was studying web design/development... and I started feeling uncomfortable about the fact that there is so much attention and money spent on websites and services that at the end of the day you can do without. That pushed me back toward games, making me think: "at least it's about telling stories" (and yes, even sorta schooling about historical events and such)... and now not so much.

    HP, you should take a good hard look at what F2P companies are doing right now: resorting to gambling gameplay mechanics to hook the shit out of their "users" so they spend more...if it's not betting on addiction then I don't know what is


    But I digress )

    Haha, hats!


    I have played TF2 since 2007 and have never spent money on hats because I'm worried once I buy one, I'll have spare change in my Steam wallet and will just keep buying pointless virtual items.


    However... I have pre-ordered games, even bought some twice (Deus Ex HR on PC and PS3) to get the pre-order Hats to use in TF2.


    I wonder how Valve can measure that.

    Blackdog, I think you're missing an important point here: It's not the purpose of games to educate or discipline kids. Don't take the moral high ground expecting games to be anything but entertainment in their strictest form.


    The argument with "kids just consuming" is a strawman, and even if this is the case when it comes to some kids, then it is the responsibility of parents to ensure that their kids can handle this. The argument makes no more sense than those religious types who want a ban on gay marriage just because they have to explain to their kids what being gay means. Our society is already filled to the brim with blame and pushed away responsibility, why the fuck would you ever want to enable or enforce more of this? If people have kids, they NEED to be responsible for them - not games, not any industry, not society as a whole. Even if said games have 'Machiavellian' F2P mechanics, these can be averted if parents take responsibility and make their kids understand what it is that the game is actually trying to do.


    If people start doing this instead of blaming games or whatever else is currently the flavor of the month "problem" is, we'd have more people that would be able to think for themselves - instead of having labels on everything.

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