Bioshock Infinite - Spoilers thread

    Quote from Furyo

    Male Lutece does not "create" a debt, he simply mentions to the 20 year older Booker that he has a way to fix it all. By going through the tear into the reality of the game however, Booker forgets all of this, and as Rosalind Lutece's book says: "The mind desperately struggles to create memories, where none exist". Once Booker is confronted with the lies he made up to fill up his blank memories, he starts bleeding from the nose every time he's reminded of the truth

    Ah right, thanks for clearing that up.

    Oh and thanks for getting this stuck in my head

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    I just finished this at 6 in the morning. A great game that left me very confused and slightly disappointed at my own inability to grasp what actually happened. Thankfully PaulH saved me from myself and after reading his post I've gotten to grips with what was what... which annoys me a bit, I spent 13 hours playing through this while looking at and listening to everything I could, trying to intake all the information possible to try and understand what was happening, and still it went over my head in places. The weird thing is, I knew about halfway through that Elizabeth / Anna was going to be Booker's daughter - I was looking at the cover during a loading screen and noticed that Booker has blue eyes. Man I felt smug when that turned up.

    So, I think what bothers me the most is the Tears / Alternate reality things. I personally see it as an explanation for everything, and somehow to me that takes away from the splendour and disbelief of all that happened, if that makes sense - I really like the vocabulary to articulate what I'm trying to say here so I hope I make sense - It's all incredibly well done and executed, but it made Colombia feel less amazing to me. And I love Bioshock 1, so the next time I play it all this is gonna be niggling away at me in the back of my mind. Not that I mind the cross-reference, but I think I would prefer if it didn't occur. But that's just my personal opinion and didn't stop me enjoying this game to the max.

    Some great moments that stood out for me were:

    • In the Asylum, in the Wardens Office you pull a lever to bring the elevator door open, then you turn around to leave and there's one of those light head things in your face. I literally went "AHH!" that hasn't happened since Amnesia.
    • The Twins. I LOVED every part with them in it. My favourite was when I was in the cable car and they appear on opposite sides as you travel along. Playing the Piano, dancing, etc. Took me a while to realise that they were the ones who brought you to the Lighthouse on the rowing boat. Also, at first, I didn't know they were Twins. I thought they were just together as a couple. Derp.
    • THE ART. OH my god THE ART. The hands down best looking part of the game was with old Elizabeth with the burning New York in 1984. I literally went "Whoa." No game since Bioshock 1 has made me impressed enough to actually say something out loud with the art. Also the orange sunset with all the lighthouses was fantastic as well. These were serious stand out places for me in a game packed full of brilliant lighting and design.
    • Walking around the Arcade with Elizabeth, nexus posted a picture above with Elizabeth holding candy-floss, fantastic. Seriously.
    • The skyhooks are neat. Feel like god damn batman flying off those rails and punching some guy in the FACE.
    • The Crows vigor. Really cool. Basically the bees plasmid from Bioshock 1 but way cooler and messier.

    Some not so great moments for me - to balance it out:

    • I didn't feel as immersed in the world as I hoped. Perhaps that can be attributed to my tastes? Maybe.. But that's not to say I didn't enjoy the world, I did, immensely! But there was just something about it that prevented me from sinking right into it.
    • No real stand out enemies. Ok ok, you could say the songbird is one, but you don't really fight him. And the big guy with the heart showing in his chest was cool. But on the whole I didn't think the cannon fodder to be terribly interesting. Is this a silly thing to focus on? I'm not sure. I just had a lot of fond memories of the splicers and big daddies in Bioshock 1.
    • Far too many pickups. During non combat I was just running around spamming e on everything. During combat I was running around spamming e on everything. Does the 1999 mode reduce the amount of stuff everywhere? I hope so as It got a bit much at times.
    • I had a hard time connecting with Elizabeth at first, it took me a fair old while to start seeing her as more than just an NPC that resupplies me on occasion. Maybe it was because Booker actually talks and I didn't really feel an actual part of it. I remember watching all the Trailers back in the day and there was one that really stood out to me: You're walking around a shop looking for stuff with Elizabeth, and you would be talking to her asking if this was what you are looking for, etc. And then the Songbird pops up and she shouts at you to hide, and you both take cover behind a table while the songbird looks through the windows - what happened to this? Whyyyyyy was it cut? I was so looking forward to this part. But in the end: Amazing character. It really did feel like I was watching a Disney Princess in a game.

    Love you all <333 thanks for the great game and breaking my mind <333

    This was my face at the end, no joke:

    [Blocked Image: http://i.imgur.com/RJGdCnx.jpg]

    Quote from dux

    I just finished this at 6 in the morning.

    somethings i did not understand . who is elisabeth?

    why was the imprisoned in that that place.

    however it was really cool to see elisabeth in the obervation areas.

    one more thing i would like to add, usually when killing enemies in the game i dont feel much sympathy..

    but that scene when father comstock dies, when u hit him on the head.. i felt sorry about him. it was kinda sad.

    wat... elisabeth is bookers daughter, she was locked up to suppress her ability to make tears and therefore be able to leave to her own reality, because comstock wanted a daughter to succeed him.

    Finished it as well. My impressions match the overall feedback so I wont go into length in them.

    I'm just amazed at how well the companion mechanics of Elizabeth are designed. She is always interacting with the environment, pointing out items and whatnot. Giving you ammo, health and tonics if you run out as well as gasping in horror every time you make a gory melee execution.

    And you don't have to take care of her health. That was a blessing!

    Quote from Furyo

    Jason will be pleased

    Whose idea was the "game" cabinets? None of them are games really. Perhaps Columbia saw through a tear into todays american gaming culture and noticed how many want instant gratification at the push of a button?

    Alright I finished it Too bad I didn't get around to playing Bioshock 1&2... I'm sure the nostalgia factor must've been awesome (only played 1h of the first).

    In all honesty, the story and idea of it were definitely (for me) the more interesting part of the game. At times I felt a bit bored and just wanted to skip to the next chapter and see what happened. For instance I explored the whole area around Comstock's House before trying to enter it the first time and then when I finally went to the house I was forced to replay the whole area, pretty much. That was an overly long experience, guess it's my own fault for wandering off but how was I supposed to know All things considered though I deem it a very solid experience.

    The "reveal" was somewhat abrupt to me, I didn't really see it coming. Some more time to let it all sink in would've been nice. When I learned Booker = Comstock I had to think for a moment to recall all earlier events that would explain this. By that time the credits had already started so there wasn't that much "OOMPH" to it as it could've had. It hurt my head, but I'm glad I was able to figure it all out.

    So I said some parts of the game felt a bit dull, perhaps puzzles could've helped, I kinda missed those. I felt some areas were a bit too "corridor" like, having to trackback for a chest with a key was a bit of a bore (the first chest in the game I think?).

    I felt there was something missing from the combat, I can't really figure out what though. Perhaps it's just not my kind of game. The enemies were very easy at times and I didn't feel like investing or using too much Vigors (except spamming the area with electricity thingies + OP blast to the skies). Perhaps it's because of how the enemies moved but there usually wasn't a "set-up" time so by the time I got the area figured out to place traps I had already blasted my way through half of the enemies. Also my fault for not remembering about Possession... Do those work on Patriots?

    Most of the enemies felt the same-ish to me although I know they weren't, I didn't really have to react particularly different to them so perhaps that's why. Except for the Patriots and Handymen, I'm glad they weren't too overused. Both provided a real challenge at times, those were some fun encounters That blast vigor is way too OP against Crows and Firemen. If I didn't have that then I feel those encounters would've been way more interesting, my fault for overusing it but oh well.

    So that's me nagging and nitpicking, I actually enjoyed the game quite a bit

    Quote from Zyn

    For example, the Songbird is still a mystery on how it came to be, what's under the hood, why is water so bad for it (other than fragile "eyes" that crack from the slightest water pressure)

    There was a Voxophone recording that talked about the pressure thing.

    Quote

    While Lucete was able to tweak the Songbird's suit to withstand low atmospheric pressure, this caused issues with high pressure, even being submerged in shallow water, being too much for it to handle.

    Quote from dux

    I didn't feel as immersed in the world as I hoped. Perhaps that can be attributed to my tastes? Maybe.. But that's not to say I didn't enjoy the world, I did, immensely! But there was just something about it that prevented me from sinking right into it.

    Rapture was a much "scarier" environment that assaulted you from the beginning, whilst Columbia gradually decayed. Survival horror-style atmosphere will always draw you in more since you're subconsciously taking more of it in.

    Wow, just finished it about an hour ago. Got to the 3rd Deck of the airship very late last night and didn't want to sully the last hour or so by playing it too tired.

    Amazing game... phew, need to let the story wash over me.

    Steam says 19 hours, and I missed just 2 audiologs

    The structure was pretty strange (in a good way), more Arkham Asylum than Bioshock 1; I kept thinking I'd be able to come back to some areas later, but it seemed almost like a linear Half-Life 1, Half-Life 2 adventure. Also, despite being 20 hours (for me ) it felt really short, I guess because it didn't feel padded out at all. I also had trouble just saving and quitting as the level starts and ends were much less obvious than Bioshock 1's which were bookended by Bathysphere rides. But I thought that was a good thing.

    I did like the Emporia level as that was the only one that reminded me of the more hub-based Bioshock 1 levels - after clearing the square, before going to Comstock House I immediately explored the gardens, found the graveyard, and then went back to the [then empty] bank. I loved being able to explore 'later' areas out of order, for some reason I find it really immersive that the world is 'all there', did the same to the nth degree in Deus Ex 3.

    Speaking of Deus Ex (and Batman), I did like that the levels in this felt more like real places than the labyrinthine levels of Bioshock 1 and 2; the police station was just the main lobby, and a few side rooms... the shops in Emporia were just one or two rooms deep. Even the bank wasn't toooo "Tardis"-y.

    Back to the story; not really what I expected, but also kind of what I expected.

    Not the game's fault, but I completely forgot Daisy got stabbed by Liz and kept wondering what had happened to her. Cool scene, though with her stabbing Fink, I kind of expected that Fink WAS me, and I was all these different characters in different timelines. Was expecting to see that scene from the POV of Fink and get stabbed by Daisy.

    At one point, I think when I saw the first Booker audiolog, with his thin facial hair... I thought Damn... he's going to be Andrew Ryan! But I'm glad they didn't do that.

    The walk through Rapture was very nice, just very emotive... but I've been mulling it over and I kind of wish it had made more sense or had some hook into BS1's story than simply being fan-service.

    When I first saw the previews, with the Twins rowing you to shore, I thought of Shutter Island... then playing the Asylum I thought of Sucker Punch... then when she was talking about her mother's memories I was thinking of Cobb conjuring up his wife in Inception... I think I was expecting some 'it was all in his head' twist, like you were in an asylum all along; I guess the chair in the lighthouse being the same chair in the asylum was just asset re-use? :s

    /Unorganized Random 1am Thoughts

    I sorta don't want there to be any more content. Sure, there are a lot of possibilities, but I can't imagine it will add much to the game. Is DLC confirmed?

    Furyo

    Thanks for clearing up some of those inaccuracies in the post I originally quoted. I actually read up online more about it afterwards and realised some of it was wrong, think am about 99% clued up on the whole story now

    This link actually explained it even better than the first I posted, but still has bits missing:

    http://www.reddit.com/r/Bioshock/com…attempt_at_the/

    dux

    What you said about finishing the game and being a bit annoyed about it going over your head was pretty much what I felt too, but then reading around it seems everyone felt that way. Not sure if it's a good or bad thing that the ending confused people and forced them to read up on it, maybe it was intentional? Or maybe the story was just too grand to explain through a FPS?

    Whatever the case I enjoyed both playthroughs, just did it on 1999 mode. It almost seemed a different game the second time around, as I actually understood what was going on in all the recordings and everything. If I had to offer any constructive criticism towards the game as a game (rather than a storytelling medium) I'd say the AI would need focusing on if there were to be future installments. It was really highlighted during my second run through that you could just enter many areas, then back out a bit and you'd easily reach points where the AI didn't bother with you any more. At one point a Handyman ended up standing behind a pillar and didn't seem to be able to see me, even though most of his body was exposed. I just stood back and shot him over and over in the heart till he died. Any of the boss fights with Lady Comstock I just ended up hiding behind a pillar, or around a corner, then popping out and shooting her, reloading and repeating. It didn't seem like there was a way I was 'supposed' to be able to defeat her, and it felt like I was just glitching a bit.

    There's also plenty of areas at the end of the game where you can either just run past the enemies (the bit with Liz in the Operating theater for example - I ignored the enemies, flipped the switches and after the cut scene the enemies disappeared). Also on the last level airship I ran through the whole deck with the handyman on it and went straight to Comstock. On the deck before that a countdown starts when you flip the switch to clear the rails, and waves of enemies come, but I just went and sat in the room behind me and waited until the coutdown finished,then nipped up to the top deck without seeing any enemies. Obviously I'm only cheating myself by doing these things, but on a second playthrough on what was supposed to be a super hardcore difficulty, I found it surprising that I was able to.

    I'm only really highlighting these things as whilst I agree that for everything else in it, this is pretty much a 10/10 game, it's not a perfect game. But it is still the best game I've played in a long time, and in terms of games with a great central story and theme I can't actually think of a better one that I've ever played.

    I still don't understand some things though. If you travel to a different universe do you:

    a) Embody "yourself", the other you? And alter your memories.

    b) Merely come into the universe, and thus... 2 versions of you exist in that universe. (And memories are still altered to accommodate this, although somewhat fucked up).

    Since Booker and Comstock were able to exist simultaneously in the events of the game I'm led to believe option B. And Daisy also said you were impostors since she saw you die, also hinting at copies of yourself.

    But the whole resolution in the end was that booker went back in time to the baptism, I assume there is only 1 booker in that universe, and killed himself which was the booker of that universe. To be consistent with how the universe thing works, doesn't it mean he needed to step into that universe at the time of the baptism and kill the other booker that was about to become Comstock? Why is he suddenly "that booker", why aren't there 2 versions there?

    Am I missing something?

    Another thing that's messing with my mind is the relevance of the "infinite loop". As far as I understood Comstock's universe HAD to exist, because it relied on stealing a foreign entity/baby from a different universe. Therefore there couldn't exist a universe where the baby wasn't stolen?

    Cos otherwise the whole plot would be nullified right, cos for every choice there's a universe. Therefore there could be a universe where Booker chose to give the baby away and a universe where he didn't. Because of the "infinite loop" however, that choice was impossible. Is my understanding of the "infinite loop" correct?

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