dear zynga

    Yeah, the Sim Tower thing has been getting ridiculous. The two theme park-related games I mentioned earlier are very similar in premise, but you can't really call them a rip-off of each other. I'm sure RollerCoaster Tycoon was pretty much based on Theme Park back in the 90s, but it very quickly became its own (better IMO) thing. Zynga's game would appear to be a literal rip, though — as in, it looks like the developers used Tiny Tower as their design document.

    Well....

    One way to think about Zynga's game, given the assumption it is the exact same gameplay just with different art direction, is what does it cost to play? If I want to get a certain amount of enjoyment out of it in a certain amount of time, how much would I have to spend? Then ask the same for Tiny Tower. Then one game might be a better "value" to the group of consumers who are actually willing to spend. Or maybe they are exactly the same? Sure, many people don't spend any money on these games but a small % of users of these types of games do indeed pay, and some pay a lot.

    If someone could show the "value curves" for each game are roughly the same, then the next question might be "Where do you want your money to go? Zynga or Nimblebit?

    Sorry but I find this issue very interesting.

    Quick update (and on topic, too!):

    http://www.industrygamers.com/news/copy ... -it-legal/

    tl;dr version: what Zynga did is legal. Unsavory, but legal. Perhaps Nimblebit's 3 man crew's best recourse is based on the following assumptions:

    1) They appear to be more creative than Zynga's 2,789 (or however many) people are allowed to be

    2) They also appear to be much, much more, ahem, nimble

    3) They have vastly smaller overhead than Zynga

    4) This (https://s3.amazonaws.com/nbpromo/dearzynga.jpg) was brilliant at creating more awareness of Tiny Tower. Not everyone appreciates its sardonic nature, but it helps put Nimblebit on more people's radar and screams "David vs. Goliath"...and most people will root for the underdog, especially given Zynga's reputation.

    So...Nimblebit: just keep doing what you do best as I'm sure you've already concluded.

    So how are Atari getting away with firing lawyers at everything that represents their classic games? I'm certain if someone cloned an original Zynga game (if such a thing can exist) it would be shut down immediately. There would just be so much money and arseholes in suits flying around that something would have to happen.

    The guy is right when he says being able to copy other mechanics is part of the progress of gaming, but copying something exactly is not part of that advancement. Everybody just cloning each other is a creative cul de sac. Also I think his closing statement, and thus the articles conclusion, is entirely wrong:

    Quote

    To make money with, for example, “yet another farm game,” it needs to be a better farm game, not just a clone.

    No, you just need to be seen by more people. The entire threat of sticking your neck out on the iOS or Flash platforms is your game can be stolen, put through a robotic cloning process and marketed by a gigantic corporation before it goes anywhere. I think this is a threat to innovation and not an incentive.

    Anyway, I don't think Nimblebit considered for a second to pursue legal action against Zynga. Nor could they afford it even if they wanted to. I would've said the image they released only had two purposes:

    [*][*:3meu4syw]Call Zygna out as lazy and uncreative.
    [*:3meu4syw]Advertise Tiny Tower.[/list]And they’ve been mostly successful. Except for a few people who think all games with the same noun in their name must play the same.

    Quote from Taylor

    So how are Atari getting away with firing lawyers at everything that represents their classic games?

    The way lawsuits (and threats of lawsuits) work is that you can basically do whatever you want without limits or recourse unless the other parties can match your ability to fund lawyers to defend themselves. Think of all those phony piracy accusations where they just mass spam official looking letters to people saying "We know you're a pirate, confess! You must pay us $5000 or we'll sue you!!". Absolutely no legal justification for that bullshit, but tons of people paid, because the time and money of defending yourself in a lawsuit is enormous, especially going up against corporately funded lawyers. There are tons of horror stories about people attempting to fight corporations in court, clearly in the right, but getting dragged out for YEARS in delays, demands, appeals, etc., driving them into bankruptcy, unemployment, and debt higher than the value of what they're fighting over. Fighting Atari (or zynga) in court would cost far more than what an iPhone app typically brings in in profit.

    Quote from FrieChamp

    Looks like Spryfox is taking it a step further: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/3989 ... olapps.php

    While this whole app store/facebook games deal facilitated breaking into the industry for talented developers, it also created a whole new generation of assholes trying to be the next millionaire with crappy products. This mindset basically destroyed Brazil's fragile games industry which is in a pretty deplorable state right now.

    It's such a shame that this is a growing trend and things will only get worse, thanks to the average consumer who doesn't care buying virtual crops from an evil company as Zynga, who has reportedly stolen money from one of the poorest people in the world (Haitians).

    I honestly wish that this company goes down as soon as possible and that all the greedy/stupid/douchebag people who invested in it take a huge financial blow with them.

    I think the growing trend of making a token effort to be respectful of others' work (ie: offering to buy them out) and then going ahead and taking their game anyway when they refuse is fairly disgusting and while it might be legally acceptable, I hope mounting pressure from the media and gamers causes companies to think twice in future. Inspiration and homage is one thing, but it's quite easy to tell the difference between that and the kind of shit posted in this thread.

    Yeah, see this is what I mean. There're plenty of ways you can lay out a bingo game and obviously bingo itself is as old a creation as it gets, but Zynga is just so brazen and shameless about it. It's like when a kid traces a drawing rather than doing it properly. Disgusting IMO.

    i remember seeing a talk from the zynga CEO, and i remember him being extremely unscrupulous and shady about how to run his business, how to use ideas etc., so yeah this does not surprise me at all.

    Quote

    ":3r25mkli]How did zynga become so big btw? Mafia Wars?

    First Mafia Wars (which is a copycat of Mob Wars), then Farmville, Cityville and dozens of other games I've never tried.

    Quote from Thrik

    Yeah, see this is what I mean. There're plenty of ways you can lay out a bingo game and obviously bingo itself is as old a creation as it gets, but Zynga is just so brazen and shameless about it. It's like when a kid traces a drawing rather than doing it properly. Disgusting IMO.

    I'm sure we remember this from a while ago. Emphasis mine:

    Quote

    In light of Zynga's phenomenal rise, one former senior employee recalls arriving at the company eager to discover what new business practices were driving its success in a market where other popular Web 2.0 ventures struggled to make money. What was Zynga's secret? Not long after starting work, he got an answer. It came directly from Zynga founder and CEO Mark Pincus at a meeting. And it wasn't what he expected."I don't fucking want innovation," the ex-employee recalls Pincus saying. "You're not smarter than your competitor. Just copy what they do and do it until you get their numbers."

    The former employee, who requested anonymity in order to speak candidly about his experience at Zynga, said this wasn't just bluster. Indeed, interviews conducted by SF Weekly with several former Zynga workers indicate that the practice of stealing other companies' game ideas — and then using Zynga's market clout to crowd out the games' originators — was business as usual.

    Quote from Taylor

    ...

    Let us not forget that this is the practice that Blizzard also uses. They copy other games, but make them so much more awesome in the process. They fix most of the stuff that is wrong with the game they are copying and have earned great success in doing so. A lot of people do this; including Steve Jobs. I am a firm believer that Steve Jobs has never had an original thought in his head, he was just really great at (stealing) tweaking other peoples' ideas to the better.

    And imo, I find that zyngas twist on all these games usually makes them look more appealing.

    Zynga is probably the most blatant and shameless of all, though. I'm not surprised they can make the original concepts a little better considering they've got millions of dollars and thousands of staff to throw around.

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