Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 Teaser

Guys, from a commercial perspective, anything this controversial would probably never even get made. When you're that big and have Walmart and Best Buy that can decide not to store your product on their shelves because of the bad brand image it would give them, you can be certain no publisher will let something that gratuitous take place. And before you take GTA as the counter example, remember that the biggest controversy there ever was was over modded content that was locked to anyone not unlocking it.

Quote from Furyo

Guys, from a commercial perspective, anything this controversial would probably never even get made. When you're that big and have Walmart and Best Buy that can decide not to store your product on their shelves because of the bad brand image it would give them, you can be certain no publisher will let something that gratuitous take place. And before you take GTA as the counter example, remember that the biggest controversy there ever was was over modded content that was locked to anyone not unlocking it.

Activision managed to "convince" the Australian ratings board not to ban the game, I'm sure they can "convince" Wal-mart to stock the game.

I really don't get what's so bad about it. You guys have been playing too much console. Going soft on us!

And Postal and GTA, in their day, were some of the better looking games.

You're so manly when you talk about the PC Dux, tell us more!

It's true though, I play so few games on my PC ever since it exploded, compared to my DS :-|

Heh, I might like nasty things full of bloodshed and mutilation but it's within reason. You see scenes like this in films all the time but the difference here is that you're in control.

Quote from Jetsetlemming

I've never seen a game that has you do it and has such shockingly realistic, desperate responses from the AI, with the screams and panic and wounded crawling and trying to hide and people trying to save friends by dragging them away. That's some serious shit right there.

See this is what I mean, nothing else before this has ever envoked this kind of harrowing reality, I just simply cannot have fun doing this, it feels wrong. In Counter-Strike, you can play as the terrorists and murder the hostages if you want to but do they get on their knees and beg for mercy or try to crawl away when wounded in the leg with their dead companion's blood soaked into their face? No not really.

To me not only is it disturbing it's also.. boring. Run through to hallway, kill everyone unarmed person in the room, move on, do it again. Someone bloodied, trying to carry their wounded companion to safety? Gun them down! Hell, better yet, feed them a load of M203 grenades, jizzing with excitement as the high pitched screams of people with no chance of survival echo throughout... yeaaaaah!

Anyway, I'll have to wait to see how it works out when I play the game but I'm betting it wont be long before the inevitable Daily Mail articles :roll:

Quote from FrieChamp

You're so manly when you talk about the PC Dux, tell us more!

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shockingly realistic, desperate responses from the AI, with the screams and panic and wounded crawling and trying to hide and people trying to save friends by dragging them away.

god damnit i'm so aroused

I think I'm gonna play through the sequence twice. Once for myself and once for you D3ads

Quote from Skjalg

I think I'm gonna play through the sequence twice. Once for myself and once for you D3ads

I'll play through it, but I'll probably be biting my lip as I go, we'll have to wait and see what the context is. The BBFC passed the game with an 18 rating anyway, if it was that much of an issue there would have been some raised eyebrows and a failed rating.

I really feel sorry for IW and Activision, having some tard leak a section which would have been a big secret until people played it. The person is seen through the monitor reflection, perhaps they'll be able to identify them. It beats the Hell out of me how they managed to get hold of the game so early anyway?

Quote from Jetsetlemming

Activision managed to "convince" the Australian ratings board not to ban the game, I'm sure they can "convince" Wal-mart to stock the game.

Speaking of which...

Quote from D3ads

See this is what I mean, nothing else before this has ever envoked this kind of harrowing reality, I just simply cannot have fun doing this

See, I think this is where people are missing the point. What they're trying to do is take their game beyond 'fun', making you seriously think about the state of the world and how horrible it is what happens to often innocent people — something that films have been doing for decades, and that games have yet to really touch me with.

I mean, you wouldn't say a film like Shindler's List is 'fun' or even 'entertaining', right? But you might still call it an incredible film. This is a distinction games haven't managed to make yet — games that aren't really what you'd call 'fun', but still deliver a powerful experience. I personally want more games that make me sit down and think about how much something I just did hit me emotionally, whereas I guess what you want is visceral entertainment (shock, scares, instant feedback). A difference of taste, I guess.

What they're doing is comparable to things like 24 which give you a keen insight into the workings of terrorist organisations, and then actually follow them as they commit atrocities. Innocent people are depicted dying in horrific ways, and it's fucking ugly. But it's what happens, and the programme is making the viewer feel the impact. Some TV critics have called this kind of thing 'glorifying violence', of course.

With games you can't really do it in the same way, unless you use a cutscene. Games are quite uniquely positioned to depict terrible things from the perspective of those actually doing it, whereas the closest films and TV can get is to watch them doing it. Infinity Ward are crossing a milestone in how seriously games will be treated as a dramatic medium IMO, and I applaud them for it.

Quote from Thrik

See, I think this is where people are missing the point. What they're trying to do is take their game beyond 'fun', making you seriously think about the state of the world and how horrible it is what happens to often innocent people — something that films have been doing for decades, and that games have yet to really touch me with.

I mean, you wouldn't say a film like Shindler's List is 'fun' or even 'entertaining', right? But you might still call it an incredible film. This is a distinction games haven't managed to make yet — games that aren't really what you'd call 'fun', but still deliver a powerful experience. I personally want more games that make me sit down and think about how much something I just did hit me emotionally, whereas I guess what you want is visceral entertainment (shock, scares, instant feedback). A difference of taste, I guess.

What they're doing is comparable to things like 24 which give you a keen insight into the workings of terrorist organisations, and then actually follow them as they commit atrocities. Innocent people are depicted dying in horrific ways, and it's fucking ugly. But it's what happens, and the programme is making the viewer feel the impact. Some TV critics have called this kind of thing 'glorifying violence', of course.

With games you can't really do it in the same way, unless you use a cutscene. Games are quite uniquely positioned to depict terrible things from the perspective of those actually doing it, whereas the closest films and TV can get is to watch them doing it. Infinity Ward are crossing a milestone in how seriously games will be treated as a dramatic medium IMO, and I applaud them for it.

Here here!

Valid points Thrik as always, I was wondering when you'd post something about this. I think it's best that I reserve judgement until I play the scenario now.

I just noticed that play.com has the game for £40, is that about $60 ? I'm useless with currency.

Also can anyone comfirm whether or not the game uses Steamworks DRM for retailed boxed? or is it just the Steam online version?

All versions of MW2 PC tie into Steam. I dunno exactly if Steam is the only DRM or what, but all of them have to be activated in Steam for sure.

Looks like that's me buying the game then looking for a crack then...

i disagree, schindler's list may very well be entertaining. not in the traditional sense mind you, but it keeps you seated all the way through - like any good piece of media should. i am perfectly sure you can make entertaining or even 'fun' games while keeping the constraint of teaching people understanding (such as showing people what is going on in the world etc.). they aren't mutually exclusive.

The best way to call it would be to say that media needs to satisfy, it can do that by making you laugh, or making making you cry. I certainly did not feel happy after i watched something like casualties of war or schindlers list but I did feel satisfied for seeing something so good, that made me so emotional. I would put Silent Hill 2 in that ballpark, I did not feel happy, but I did feel satisfied after playing that game because it was a good mature sad story.

Should murdering a load of women and children in cold blood be fun? I think they do need to be mutually exclusive. Just like how when watching Schindler's List I didn't sit there with a big smile on my face like I do during an adrenaline-fuelled action movie, but I did still enjoy the experience. 'Entertaining' was a shit word to use though, I couldn't think of a good equivalent to 'fun' in a movie context.