9/11 - some scientific stuff to think about it

[Minos]

the tail is made of aluminum. i went camping once and made a kind of big fire, we threw some cans in and they melted immediately. Now imagine a plane flying at 400mph, filled with fuel, crashing into a hard building.

haha man, please, there's HUGE difference between a soda can and an airplane's tail. We have already seen loads of plane accidents and the tail is always there.

he didn't land it

uh. From the image it seems that it hit the first floor, how can a plane hit the first floor of a 4-story building without touching the ground ? I still can't believe that unexperienced pilots performed such a hard trick. You have to know exactly the time to start going down, to reduce speed etc...

And what about the FBI retrieving tapes showing the "alleged" plane impact ? Why would they do it if they have nothing to hide. And do you really think that there was only one camera filming the entire pentagon ? That shit is like a fortress there must be cameras on every spot of the building.

And how could such a "small" fire melt the entire plane down ?

Besides that all, if I were a terrorist I would have hit the most important area of the building (the donald rummsfeld cabinet) and not the nearly reinforced and less important one. If you were a terrorist and had to plan such a big attack you would know things like that.

PS: Independently from having seen that documentary these are just points that I have noticed by myself, after reading news and viewing images of the impact.

[Bic-B@ll]

we have?

it did touch the ground, maybe if you looked at this:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread79655/pg1

you would see that the plane hit phone poles, took out a fence, hit a generator, DID hit the ground, and hit BETWEEN the first and second floors

http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/pentagon/images/1.jpg

http://69.57.144.30/ats/pentagon757/gen ... fence1.jpg

http://69.57.144.30/ats/pentagon757/gen ... -small.jpg

"Even though the two airplanes flown into the World Trade Center towers were travelling faster at the time of impact than the Pentagon plane was (400 MPH vs. 350 MPH), hit aluminum-and-glass buildings rather than reinforced concrete walls, and didn't dissipate much of their energy striking the ground first (as the Pentagon plane did), they still barely penetrated all the way through the WTC towers."

"As eyewitnesses described and photographs demonstrate, the hijacked airliner dived so low as it approached the Pentagon that it actually hit the ground first, thereby dissipating much of the energy that might otherwise have caused more extensive damage to the building; nonetheless, as described by The New York Times, the plane still hit not "just the ground floor" but between the first and second floors:"

"The Boeing 757 crashed into the outer edge of the building between the first and second floors, "at full power," Mr. Rumsfeld said. It penetrated three of the five concentric rings of the building."

http://www.snopes.com/rumors/pentagon.htm

about the debris:

http://911review.com/errors/pentagon/nodebris.html

http://911review.com/errors/pentagon/crashdebris.html

[RD]

uh. From the image it seems that it hit the first floor, how can a plane hit the first floor of a 4-story building without touching the ground ? I still can't believe that unexperienced pilots performed such a hard trick. You have to know exactly the time to start going down, to reduce speed etc...

The Pentagon is humongous. All they had to do was fly the plane in it somewhere. If they hit another spot you'd probably have said it is very hard to hit it exactly there, but the truth is it is almost impossible to miss something that big, you always hit it somewhere. Just like someone can fire a gun and hit a brick in the pyramids from 10miles away, it doesnt make him a sharpshooter. Well it does if he can hit it twice.

Besides that all, if I were a terrorist I would have hit the most important area of the building (the donald rummsfeld cabinet) and not the nearly reinforced and less important one. If you were a terrorist and had to plan such a big attack you would know things like that.

Maybe they werent such good pilots :roll: Why would they have to hit Rummsfeld anyway? You probably only ever heard of Rummsfeld AFTER 911.

In Iraq there are hundreds of terrorists, but none of them target Rummsfelds car when hes on visit. Maybe they are missiles too? Such "big" attacks they must know exactly where and when Rummsfeld is in Iraq?

[Section_Ei8ht]

Just like someone can fire a gun and hit a brick in the pyramids from 10miles away, it doesnt make him a sharpshooter.

Thats actually a lot harder than it sounds, especially at 10 miles away.

[Taylor]

This thread reminds me of a conspiracy theory programme I saw on 9/11. Lots of people speak outrageous claims about 9/11 for an hour, about how there were explosions inside, skyscrapers aren’t built with the idea of them ever collapsing, there’s not enough debris (mainly about the pentagon), to the point where you actually start believing some of it.

Then they bring in scientists, engineers and professors of whatever for the last half hour who say "well, actually, that's all bullshit." To which the conspiracy theorists retort "well, you can prove anything with facts."

[Minos]

uh. From the image it seems that it hit the first floor, how can a plane hit the first floor of a 4-story building without touching the ground ? I still can't believe that unexperienced pilots performed such a hard trick. You have to know exactly the time to start going down, to reduce speed etc...

The Pentagon is humongous. All they had to do was fly the plane in it somewhere. If they hit another spot you'd probably have said it is very hard to hit it exactly there, but the truth is it is almost impossible to miss something that big, you always hit it somewhere. Just like someone can fire a gun and hit a brick in the pyramids from 10miles away, it doesnt make him a sharpshooter. Well it does if he can hit it twice.

Yeah I agree. hitting something as big as the WTC is easy but you will have to agree with me that hitting a 4-story building with a highway next to it must be pretty hard

Besides that all, if I were a terrorist I would have hit the most important area of the building (the donald rummsfeld cabinet) and not the nearly reinforced and less important one. If you were a terrorist and had to plan such a big attack you would know things like that.

Maybe they werent such good pilots :roll: Why would they have to hit Rummsfeld anyway? You probably only ever heard of Rummsfeld AFTER 911.

In Iraq there are hundreds of terrorists, but none of them target Rummsfelds car when hes on visit. Maybe they are missiles too? Such "big" attacks they must know exactly where and when Rummsfeld is in Iraq?

Yeah I agree, I had never heard of Donald before 911 but the terrorists certainly did. When planning such attacks you will try to cause just as much harm as you can... If I were a terrorist I wouldn't hit the opposite (and just reinforced area) of Donald's office. Besides that all, the flight school owners said that the alleged terrorists were mediocre pilots.

[Bic-B@ll]

uh. From the image it seems that it hit the first floor, how can a plane hit the first floor of a 4-story building without touching the ground ? I still can't believe that unexperienced pilots performed such a hard trick. You have to know exactly the time to start going down, to reduce speed etc...

The Pentagon is humongous. All they had to do was fly the plane in it somewhere. If they hit another spot you'd probably have said it is very hard to hit it exactly there, but the truth is it is almost impossible to miss something that big, you always hit it somewhere. Just like someone can fire a gun and hit a brick in the pyramids from 10miles away, it doesnt make him a sharpshooter. Well it does if he can hit it twice.

Yeah I agree. hitting something as big as the WTC is easy but you will have to agree with me that hitting a 4-story building with a highway next to it must be pretty hard

.

what does the highway have to do with anything? if you look at the flight path it follows the highway and goes right into the building, the only obsticales were light poles, which the plane did hit. fly low in a straight path and drop down until you tap the ground, bounce up and hit into the building.

[RD]

Yeah I agree. hitting something as big as the WTC is easy but you will have to agree with me that hitting a 4-story building with a highway next to it must be pretty hard

If you aim too low, you bounce off the floor into the side of the Pentagon, if you aim to high you enter the center of the Pentagon from above. How can you miss?

Yeah I agree, I had never heard of Donald before 911 but the terrorists certainly did. When planning such attacks you will try to cause just as much harm as you can... If I were a terrorist I wouldn't hit the opposite (and just reinforced area) of Donald's office. Besides that all, the flight school owners said that the alleged terrorists were mediocre pilots.

They switched off autopilot, the transponder, and aimed the nose.

[Minos]

Yeah man but you still have to know the exact time to start pointing the nose down... And why not just release the tapes with the alleged plane crash and end all these conspiracy theories ?

[RD]

Yeah man but you still have to know the exact time to start pointing the nose down... And why not just release the tapes with the alleged plane crash and end all these conspiracy theories ?

Know the exact time? You look out of the cockpit and point the nose towards the pentagon. When you drive a car youre not using a stopwatch to make turns do you?

And its probably humiliating or just bad PR showing their military HQ under attack, if there even are such tapes

[Bic-B@ll]

i do agree that it's sketchy that they won't release the tapes. they'll show that security cam footage which shows basically nothing, people have been pasting 757s and cruse missiles in it to prove their theories, another camera angle could shed some light on what happened. though i still don't agree with what you're saying about aiming the plane. it's relatively flat terrain, there is a road to follow, and they have an altimeter. just fly into the building.

[Ginger Lord]

I don't know about you, but flying planes at low level in Flight Simulator is pretty damn hard let alone in real life.

[RD]

they didnt fly the plane at low level, they crashed it. o m g

[Minos]

RD you should go play some flight simulator. It's not just "POINT THE FUCKER DOWN AND WOAH WE MADE IT!".

[The Postman]

RD you should go play some flight simulator. It's not just "POINT THE FUCKER DOWN AND WOAH WE MADE IT!".

You're basing your knowledge of airplane flight on flight simulators? Wow.