the new cartoon thread

[Scraps]

Aaaw, FFS postman, give it up. You lose. Accept it pls k thx bye! Very Happy

This discussion is going totally nowhere: RD is repeating it's points and you keep making beautiful little pirouettes around them, claiming you are bashing them.

Abusive behaviour and using alot of powerfull terms and cursing does not make you win or summin dude, just accept your losses, let go you pride and get that bloodpressure under control before it gets you.

Oh, and btw, this is the 5th time youre about to delete my post. Smile

Everything you post is garbage. Your posts are unfounded, your arguments are puerile and your grasp of debate is laughable. While Postman may have a differeing opinion than you, he is certainly addressing these points and countering them. Everything that you post is shit. Stop posting, read a book and get some opinions with a factual basis. You know what? Let me reiterate that. STOP POSTING

Postman isn't necessarily right. RD isn't necessarily right. In issues of foreign policy, there is no objective or empirical right.

But you are wrong. You are uninformed and ignorant. You have contributed nothing to this discussion.

Go reread Postman's long and what was presumed to be his final post in this thread. It wraps everything said into a nice little package and shows a very complex and well-informed understanding of the situation. While it isn't necessarily my own feelings on the topic, it is a very well-reasoned and logical argument.

I'm staying out of this thread for the most part. While I have the gist of the history of the middle east, I'm not nearly as informed on the topic as I'd like to be.

Oh, one more thing.

STOP POSTING.

[The Postman]

Page one of the old thread that was locked.

Then reference the proper thread next time.

You know the definition of justified? Having a valid reason.

The people doing it thought it was justified. Those who can look at it objectively know that it wasn't. That's the difference.

A man can murder his wife because she cheated. She is still not responsible.

She's responsible for her own actions, not her husband's. However she must've known he'd respond quite negatively if he found out. There are more levels to this than simple black and white reasoning that you seem to be fond of.

[Scraps]

scraps is postmans 2nd account. 10 posts in total and all made in political discussion. :wink:

Is that all you've got?

Please.

[The Postman]

scraps is postmans 2nd account. 10 posts in total and all made in political discussion. :wink:

Is that all you've got?

Please.

Flamewar over. Back to the topic at hand. That goes for both Killer and Scraps.

[Fletch]

scraps is postmans 2nd account. 10 posts in total and all made in political discussion. :wink:

IP's aren't even vaguely close to each other. But nice attempt at an ad hominem attack. Don't do it again.

[st0lve]

A man can murder his wife because she cheated. She is still not responsible.

RD, in Iraq an Iraqi who was living in Norway went back to Iraq with his wife, and killed her (she was Norwegian).

The man was going to be executed by hanging.

His reason was that he thought she cheated.

[RD]

The people doing it thought it was justified. Those who can look at it objectively know that it wasn't. That's the difference.

Then look at this objectively and tell me who has to apologise for the riots.

A man can murder his wife because she cheated. She is still not responsible.

She's responsible for her own actions, not her husband's. However she must've known he'd respond quite negatively if he found out. There are more levels to this than simple black and white reasoning that you seem to be fond of.

What you did was say over and over again why they are rioting, and that we are responsible. You explained everything except why their reasoning is flawed. Sometimes you wrote that that they are completely wrong, but you never explained why. If you skip that, it is the definition of justifying. Extremists recruit PEOPLE by explaining the conflict while at the basis of their reasoning is a black hole.

You prefer to explain how understandable it all is for a reason, and i wonder what it is.

Do you know why they were wrong to even get angry at us about the drawings? I doubt it, you probably disagree with it because it is so understandable.

[RD]

A man can murder his wife because she cheated. She is still not responsible.

RD, in Iraq an Iraqi who was living in Norway went back to Iraq with his wife, and killed her (she was Norwegian).

The man was going to be executed by hanging.

His reason was that he thought she cheated.

So what are you saying? Shes responsible in some way because the mere thought of cheating is worth killing over in the middle east?

[The Postman]

Then look at this objectively and tell me who has to apologise for the riots.

Denmark. The spark that ignited all this lies at their fault. However now I think the riots will probably cease due to the whole mosque explosion in Iraq. I think that'll grab some attention.

What you did was say over and over again why they are rioting, and that we are responsible. You explained everything except why their reasoning is flawed. Sometimes you wrote that that they are completely wrong, but you never explained why. If you skip that, it is the definition of justifying. Extremists recruit ppl by explaining the conflict while at the basis of their reasoning is a black hole.

You prefer to explain how understandable it all is for a reason, and i wonder what it is.

My point is that their reasoning is flawed. So how do you fix it? Go read my nice long post on this very subject earlier in the thread.

Do you know why they were wrong to even get angry at us about the drawings? I doubt it, you probably disagree with it because it is so understandable.

Wait, what? They were wrong to get angry about being insulted?

[rockdude86]

Then look at this objectively and tell me who has to apologise for the riots.

Denmark. The spark that ignited all this lies at their fault. However now I think the riots will probably cease due to the whole mosque explosion in Iraq. I think that'll grab some attention.

What you did was say over and over again why they are rioting, and that we are responsible. You explained everything except why their reasoning is flawed. Sometimes you wrote that that they are completely wrong, but you never explained why. If you skip that, it is the definition of justifying. Extremists recruit ppl by explaining the conflict while at the basis of their reasoning is a black hole.

You prefer to explain how understandable it all is for a reason, and i wonder what it is.

My point is that their reasoning is flawed. So how do you fix it? Go read my nice long post on this very subject earlier in the thread.

Do you know why they were wrong to even get angry at us about the drawings? I doubt it, you probably disagree with it because it is so understandable.

Wait, what? They were wrong to get angry about being insulted?

allright...

first thing: Denmark is not responsible for those people rioting, they are responsible for that themselves. AND if there would be someone to blame for this it would be the ones who made the cartoons, not a whole country.

second thing: yes their reasoning is flawed. fix it? no, why? they have to "fix" that themselves. as simple as that. as long as they dont realise they are being wrong they wont change, theres nothing to do about that.

third thing: one thing here you should understand is that A: people are allowed to feel insulted by something like this on that i have to agree with you BUT and here comes B: a "reasonable" person would laugh about a "joke" like this and think: hey its just someone elses opinion what the hell do i care.

think about this... then come back. thank you.

[The Postman]

allright...

first thing: Denmark is not responsible for those people rioting, they are responsible for that themselves. AND if there would be someone to blame for this it would be the ones who made the cartoons, not a whole country.

Agreed. Excuse my blanket statement. I should've clarified that.

second thing: yes their reasoning is flawed. fix it? no, why? they have to "fix" that themselves. as simple as that. as long as they dont realise they are being wrong they wont change, theres nothing to do about that.

This is what I already wrote.

third thing: one thing here you should understand is that A: people are allowed to feel insulted by something like this on that i have to agree with you BUT and here comes B: a "reasonable" person would laugh about a "joke" like this and think: hey its just someone elses opinion what the hell do i care.

think about this... then come back. thank you.

It's something they feel very strongly about, though. That's the difference. Read my long diatribe up there, I think I cover a little of this too.

[neotic]

The KKK felt very strongly about keeping blacks from registerting to vote. The Vatican felt very strongly against science. The (an oppressing ignorant group) felt very strongly about keeping (x) in place out of ignorance.

Should we just mantain the status quo because these people will get upset, of course not. These actions, these riots, originated as a response to criticism, these riots are simply justifying and perpetuating those very criticisms and for that I believe they (Denmark) are not irresponsible. Proper and legit criticism regardless of the backlash is still proper and legit criticism and that should never be ignored or suppressed.

[rockdude86]

to postman: ok then we are both kind of right here

[st0lve]

RD what I was trying to say is that the Muslim world isn't all that the men always win as you said (I recall you did atleast).

[RD]

The KKK felt very strongly about keeping blacks from registerting to vote. The Vatican felt very strongly against science. The (an oppressing ignorant group) felt very strongly about keeping (x) in place out of ignorance.

Should we just mantain the status quo because these people will get upset, of course not. These actions, these riots, originated as a response to criticism, these riots are simply justifying and perpetuating those very criticisms and for that I believe they (Denmark) are not irresponsible. Proper and legit criticism regardless of the backlash is still proper and legit criticism and that should never be ignored or suppressed.

My point to Posty exactly. There is no need to apologise for speaking the truth.

Wait, what? They were wrong to get angry about being insulted?

NOW can you imagine why you should never have explained it the way you did? You even made yourself blind to the black hole that is their reasoning.

1) We are not the cartoonists. We have no control over drawings because theres freedom. The government does not control the media.

2) The cartoons were not a childish lash at the ME. They are the truth. They are reactions to REAL events where muslims with bombs in their hats blew us up screaming for their god. You thinking its just us being childish boils down to you having ignored my point of how dangerous it is here to criticise Islam. Its the truth, and i posted pictures to prove my point, pictures of angry crowds in European streets threatening to behead those who insult Islam, which you deleted. Even after you saw them you didnt believe it. You missed the singularity of the black hole and called me childish for pointing it out.

3) Anger is a weakness. You yourself are responsible for controlling it.

My point is that their reasoning is flawed. So how do you fix it? Go read my nice long post on this very subject earlier in the thread.

Your explanation of how to fix it is proven false, because we ALREADY DID IT IN EUROPE FOR YEARS. Hopefully you understand that because there is individual freedom that we have 0 control over what PEOPLE draw, which means there will be riots every week depending on some imam not being too lazy to take the drawings to the ME and twist its context.

You also hopefully listened to my earlier point that printing it has NOTHING to do with the problem, because if we hadnt printed it they would riot because it is on a Danish website.

I am not going to read your posts again, but what i will do for you, is suggest you read mine again, or better, neotics

In order to make muslims aware that they have made a mistake and to actually change something instead of pretending theres no problem, you have to make them aware of the black hole in their reasoning. In this case, the black hole is in Islam.