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@Castle is this you? :D 

 

Great insights, keep them coming! 

The more I think about VR, the more I think that it's a misconception that it's a "replacement"  for real life. Just like any other new media, it will have its own applications and uses, and we are barely scratching the surface of what's possible. I really have no interest to play games where you shoot robots or zombies (like 90% of VR games). But visiting the Cologne Cathedral in VR was a great experience.

VR is in a strange space right now, because it's too small to make quality projects financially feasible, so most of the stuff we see is sub-par mobile games trying to make a quick buck. There are some interesting experiences, but they are all very niche. Honestly, it's a very exciting space, kind of like the internet before Facebook ruined it all :)

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I am in an interesting situation now where I have been active with metaverse content creation for a few years. I noticed that player numbers have been exploding in the VR club scene recently so I deci

This seems to be a step in the right direction to rectify that weight problem: https://research.fb.com/blog/2020/06/holographic-optics-for-thin-and-lightweight-virtual-reality/

Are the girls hot? (my pandemic lay count is depressing) 

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Ok maybe this was a mistake. I was kinda not expecting this to go like this and I did ask before saying anything. Like I understand the reaction "lol erp" but honestly you gotta be thinking about this in greater depth than that.

Just so you know I developed a VR COOP PVE Zombie shooter similar to left for dead and currently have the most technically advanced live event world in VRC as well as connections with a lot of the biggest streamers and communities in the scene. I also exploring how to monetize in ways nobody is currently doing.

sorry for interrupting the conversation about the future of VR I guess.
Ill head out now 

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2 hours ago, Castle said:

Assuming its all just because of ERP is pretty ignorant.

I didn't, my point was simply that you present a very specific perspective, and when you offhandedly post;

5 hours ago, Castle said:

18+ for anything I am involved with.

10 hours ago, Castle said:

There is a lot of money in providing tactile senses while in VR. But something like this would barely be a gimmick for something like HLA but for a social platform it would probably disrupt the entire porn industry.

4 hours ago, Castle said:

The semi famous streamers and youtube content creators to exotic pole dancing cat girls. The variety of different hotness levels will likely bend your brain. 

I think I can reasonably assert to have a adequate view of what that perspective is. ( yes, the third quote was you responding to a question - so it's not offhanded )

8 hours ago, Castle said:

Alcoholism is also big in VR. I know multiple people who have suffered deteriorated health from over drinking. Its extremely common to have a live show or club event where people pass out in game. Your concerns are easily justified.

Are those people living their best life?

Look, I'm not here to pretend to be a moral authority, nor to insult you ( hence why my previous post was so vague - but alas here we go ) but if we're gonna be discussing VR as a new frontier, lets please take a second to consider what impacts this may have on people's lives, and at the very least not literally chase towards a dystopia.

2 hours ago, Castle said:

sorry for interrupting the conversation about the future of VR I guess.
Ill head out now 

You're not interrupting anything, this is without a doubt a discussion which needs to be had - although I personally believe you approached it from the wrong angle.

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* this post was about twice as long but has been abridged to avoid offence & remove loosely related topics, including

- (micro-)parasociality & cult behaviour on the internet

- porn addiction & [redacted]

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Porn is pretty inextricably tied to technological advancements, pretty much everything with people traces back to sex, but it's also a bit outside the scope of our forums, which are tied more directly to the mainstream games industry. 

So, more rated R here as opposed to rated X. That said, I imagine as time goes on with VR (and I guess already, to an extent) it's going to get HARDER and HARDER to discuss without talking about society's collective proclivities.

I don't know if I would call that dystopic so much as more of the same for human beings. What concerns me more is how Facebook is obviously looking to extend the present control they have over people on Facebook and Instagram into VR, which they obviously hope to monopolize. It would be nice if Valve made more of a play for the mainstream and competed with Oculus on middle-end devices, because otherwise people will just drift more and more into that monopolized space.

If people are hanging out more and more in VR, but it's just a lifeless extension of Facebook via patent-trolling, lack of competition and oppressive advertising, that *would* be rather dystopian.

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3 hours ago, FMPONE said:

I don't know if I would call that dystopic so much as more of the same for human beings.

That piece of my post may have been decontextualized when I cut out the middle part; the dystopia wasn't meant to be linked directly to adult content, it was just a summary of the whole matter.

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On a lighter note: a concept I came up with like 7 years ago;

"like what if there was an MMO except it was also a bank - and instead of milking people dry through microtransactions, you like earn in-game points daily based on the amount in your savings account or something idk"

Edited by ThunderKeil
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On 4/19/2021 at 5:01 PM, ThunderKeil said:

I think I can reasonably assert

"exclusively using the platform for ERP" was a shit thing to say especially in light of the fact that I am in a process now of trying to push things forward. Does that ALSO include sexual content? Does a bear shit in the woods? Like seriously, what was the point of going off like that? So after I read what you said I realized that it was likely that more than a few people were reading what I was saying through some lens like like all I am talking about is porn. That was it, porn is the only thing being talked about nothing else mattered. I just felt like fuck this... I left to cool off for a bit but it I was seriously worried about the prospect of trying to explain this to people on the outside. I was seriously expecting to come back to a bunch of "HAHA point and laugh at the porno person" remarks lol...

The only reason I mentioned that age does not matter is because in my experience people of all ages and everything else tend to interact very well in VR. VR is extremely inclusive, its easily the most progressive thing humanity has by a large margin. It had nothing to do with sex in the context of "age not mattering". I am 42 years old and a damn large chunk of my friends are in early 20s and most of them think I am still 25. The oldest person I ever hung out with was Mark Hamill who I met a couple years ago in a random public lobby where he and another Joker voice actor were just randomly hanging out acting in character. lol... But reading over my post I can easily see someone reading it and thinking it was about having sex with a 68 year old LMAO!!! I just laughed and cried at the same time. Not going to lie this shit was bugging me for a couple days! I was having an existential crises.

"Is this what normies are thinking right now?" 

The reason I mentioned 18 is because its usually involves a lot of drinking and being in bars and clubs. People below 18 are too young to be around for that, they dont belong in a bar or club in real life they don't need to be in one in VR. This was not about an exclusively sexual context, its adult content point blank. If you are under 18 go play Roblox. 

On 4/19/2021 at 5:01 PM, ThunderKeil said:

Are those people living their best life?

No its terrifying and sad point blank. But people have reasons for being this way. Sometimes they caught the L because someone they loved passed away. That can be insanely hard to deal with and VR can help give them a place to morn. This is how a metaverse works and if you don't understand it you wont be able to help them. You will also be blind to that demographic. Barging into their lives and telling them to "git good" wont help.

On 4/19/2021 at 5:01 PM, ThunderKeil said:

I'm not here to pretend to be a moral authority

You sound like a boomer complaining about bitcoin. Good now that we are even, since I am apparently exclusively using VR to ERP, lets continue the actual conversation.

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The main thing to talk about here is that VR and metaverse content is a disruptive technology.
This being a disruptive technology, take a giant whiff. This is what a disruptive technology looks, feels and smells like. This is highly disruptive to everything. (Yes including but not limited to the porn industry)

The metaverse is a black hole that sucks everyone and everything into it. VR is very disruptive. The entire internet is going to be viewed through a metaverse eventually. 

On 4/19/2021 at 1:52 PM, Minos said:

@Castle is this you? :D 

Sadly lol... I am in way deeper than that person. If you stare into the metaverse it will stare back at you. lol
I am beyond the existential part and now I am starting to need an outlet to talk to people on the outside.

On 4/19/2021 at 1:52 PM, Minos said:

The more I think about VR, the more I think that it's a misconception that it's a "replacement"  for real life. Just like any other new media, it will have its own applications and uses, and we are barely scratching the surface of what's possible. I really have no interest to play games where you shoot robots or zombies (like 90% of VR games). But visiting the Cologne Cathedral in VR was a great experience.

VR is in a strange space right now, because it's too small to make quality projects financially feasible, so most of the stuff we see is sub-par mobile games trying to make a quick buck. There are some interesting experiences, but they are all very niche. Honestly, it's a very exciting space, kind of like the internet before Facebook ruined it all :)

Visiting a place in VR and having that experience changes you in a way that is hard to explain. Its not a replacement its merely just an alternate internet. Its a recreation of the internet, in fact, done in a way that is more conducive to humanity in general. Social media is just the first experiment and it had so many problems. Virtual reality allows you to physically be there spending time with others. Experiencing things together. While that may entail a lot of various kinds of activities, if you directly compare it to sharing pictures of food on Instagram its a straight objective upgrade. Pictures of food don't communicate with you. They don't watch movies or play games with you. Facebook is a relic of the past not the future. Virtual reality is the reimagining of everything digital in ways much greater than shooting robots or zombies. You now shoot robots and zombies together while drinking and having fun with friends and its on some random world made by some random person.

On 4/19/2021 at 6:37 PM, FMPONE said:

So, more rated R here as opposed to rated X. That said, I imagine as time goes on with VR (and I guess already, to an extent) it's going to get HARDER and HARDER to discuss without talking about society's collective proclivities.

Exactly. People want cool looking avatars. Those avatars must then also must be attractive. The attention you receive for having an attractive avatar is amazing. The desire for an even more attractive avatar grows. The attention you get is even better. You then begin looking into getting full body. The attention and immersion is increased exponentially. This process seems to be extremely common. Once you compile this pattern with the fact that various games and activities will be directly tied to a metaverse you can bet your ass most people will be very attractive while they are playing other games attached to the metaverse. I agree with you 100% on this.

When people pick their avatars it becomes them. They will want to be that avatar in places even outside of the metaverse.

On 4/19/2021 at 6:37 PM, FMPONE said:

I don't know if I would call that dystopic so much as more of the same for human beings. What concerns me more is how Facebook is obviously looking to extend the present control they have over people on Facebook and Instagram into VR, which they obviously hope to monopolize. It would be nice if Valve made more of a play for the mainstream and competed with Oculus on middle-end devices, because otherwise people will just drift more and more into that monopolized space.

This is an extremely important discussion right now. My take is that MOST people right now are clueless about what VR actually is. Most are still on some wave that it will be like releasing a new console or video game engine. Oh this is way more than that. Facebook seems to kind of have a clue what is going on and thus they are pushing their headsets but they are basically mentally deranged.

Making a headset that is capable of playing a metaverse game like VRChat, Neos, Chillout VR and then having the absolute tone deaf gal to attempt to force people to use a facebook account is beyond hilarity. This is the dumbest fucking thing in recent history. On one hand you have the next step in internet culture poised at disrupting the shit out of everything digital. And then on the other they attempt to get you to make a shitty throw away account for one of the most awful limited and dystopic failing platforms on the internet. LMAO!!! The only immediate comparison I can think of regarding this would be to have filled the Hindenburg with C4 explosives in an attempt to get it off the ground.

So what I am thinking that they are doing is hoping to try and make a metaverse that will be within some kind of walled garden right. The walled garden metaverse will always fail in when compared to a more open and free experience. Better memes more people to hang out with, sexier avatars, better live shows, better events, more indie games, less restriction on avatars. The more disruptive the metaverse is the better it will be for most people.

On 4/19/2021 at 6:37 PM, FMPONE said:

If people are hanging out more and more in VR, but it's just a lifeless extension of Facebook via patent-trolling, lack of competition and oppressive advertising, that *would* be rather dystopian.

A walled garden metaverse is an oxymoron.

I am going to tell you right now, VR is still under the radar for most things that are about to get obliterated by the disruption. Most people have no clue how insanely all encompassing this is going to be. Gabe Newell is the only one on the upper echelons that seems to have an idea of what an "extinction level event for all other media" might look like in regards to his BCI.

We are having WAY too much fun right now. Once people start to realize what is happening it will be too late and it will cause a wave of panic for anyone who has not been paying attention. The metaverse is the killer app. 

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On 4/19/2021 at 1:52 PM, Minos said:

@Castle is this you? :D 

Oh by the way I was in that video and I chilled with that guy for awhile actually. One of the live shows he showed was called Slyfest. I am also acquaintances with Sly and contributed to projects he was a part of. 

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I think it is important to keep in mind VRChat and the likes are nothing more than fun social games.

The science fiction concept of 'metaverse' is nothing more than that. Games inspired by it will always remain as a subsection of the internet and don't threaten to be disruptive to.. anything really.

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1 hour ago, Terri said:

I think it is important to keep in mind VRChat and the likes are nothing more than fun social games.

False because games can be built inside of the social platform. We are at a point now where with the addition of a couple basic things the social platform becomes a gaming platform with full blown monetization. VRChat itself is one or two features away from becoming a virtual STEAM.

edit : Many of these features were recently announced as well. Also I am going to be riding this wave as hard as possible and I will be developing full blown games. If nobody else does it I will be doing it.

Edited by Castle
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2 hours ago, Terri said:

Full blown games, with a programming language that runs 300,000 times slower than the already offensively bad mono runtime?

The only thing that slows everyone down in a VR social game is the 80 people in the lobby with unoptimized avatars. Or you can check out Just B club with its 1500 concurrent active users at all times. Hey know what, keep making indie VR games that barely get 10 active users even though they have super efficient scripting languages. 

edit : Or experience getting your game ripped off and played to death in the VR community AmongUs style. AmongUs in VRC is infinitely superior experience lol.

edit 2 : I remember having a similar debate regarding this in the Unreal 4 engine where blueprints were slammed for not being viable compared to C++. The honest answer is that most gameplay does not require an efficient scripting language and most things that a 3d engine does that will require efficiency is not part of the scripting. Udon# in VRC and Logix in NEOS VR are super slow compared to native language support but in the end they are extremely good for gameplay stuff which usually does not require a hefty amount of computations. People moving in and out of trigger volumes, trigging RPCs or events like shooting a gun or taking damage. These are not calculated every frame in an update loop.

Skyrim has a super slow scripting system as well utilizing a similar structure. Most game engines do.

Edited by Castle
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4 hours ago, Castle said:

 I am 42 years old and a damn large chunk of my friends are in early 20s and most of them think I am still 25.

4 hours ago, Castle said:

You sound like a boomer

4 hours ago, Castle said:

"Is this what normies are thinking right now?" 

I legitimately cannot find a way to reply to this without getting a mod warning

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20 minutes ago, ThunderKeil said:

I legitimately cannot find a way to reply to this without getting a mod warning

Don't worry, I am exclusively ERPing on the forum. I should be banned.

I don't believe you understand how much that pissed me off. I coordinate with dozens and dozens of community managers, DJs and content creators every week to setup live events shows. Lighting effects world creation programming and all kinds of stuff. I researched and work on tons of content and communicate with people to work within a bustling community. But fuck all that, I exclusively use it to ERP apparently.

anyway, we are even now I think. :P

Edited by Castle
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