Freya [Wingman]

[Rump3L]

Workshop link

 

Theme setting => snowy, night, scandinavian (most likely Norway)

 

Layout theory:

Starts out pretty simple for Ts, upon progressing more possibilities open up. CTs can play this in numerous ways, ranging from a back defense to an offensive chokepoint hold. Connector crossing the middle part of the map provides fast rotates and flanking options for both teams, starting with CTs initially if they choose to hold offensively. Skybox is currently open for the most part.

Previous version showed up in the playtest as heavily CT sided despite the number of entrances. The problem was that the site was way too strong to hold from (too many camping spots, a bunch of weird angles for the pushing team, entrances too close to another). CTs were pretty much forced to stay on such a site since they had a hard time holding further away from the objective. Ts had way too much map control right from the start. Uppermost route took way too long and was too exposed to the site. This version tries to address these issues.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for stopping by and also, how does playtesting specifically a wingman map on mapcore work?

Edited December 8, 2020 by Rump3L
new version, getting it ready for further playtesting across communities

[Radu]

Maybe you should do a collab with @Freyja

If you're on the Mapcore Discord, drop a message in the Playtest channel. One of our qualified playtest engineers will be with you shortly.

[Lizard]

Layout looks interesting. If you are going for a winter setting with snow I would recommend a bit brighter environment light. Moon light bounces of the snow on the ground making everything looks a lot brighter. You can use this to your advantage because you have a night map (should be dark) but the snow will reflect the light around making everything look almost as bright as if it was a day map.

[Rump3L]

4 hours ago, Radu said:

Maybe you should do a collab with @Freyja

If you're on the Mapcore Discord, drop a message in the Playtest channel. One of our qualified playtest engineers will be with you shortly.

@Radu  well, actually there is a possibility of a collab with someone if the time starts pressuring me. Aight, will do once ready, ty!

 

1 hour ago, Lizard said:

Layout looks interesting. If you are going for a winter setting with snow I would recommend a bit brighter environment light. Moon light bounces of the snow on the ground making everything looks a lot brighter. You can use this to your advantage because you have a night map (should be dark) but the snow will reflect the light around making everything look almost as bright as if it was a day map.

@Lizard Thanks man, nice tip. So my guess is basically to either stick with snowfall and make env light a bit brighter but also depend more on the warmness of street lights or to abandon the snowfall effect, have an actual moon and make env light a bit more brighter but colder? Because I feel like a certain deal of moonlight gets lost in the density of snowfall and sky. Atm the pitch is on -90 btw

[Lizard]

10 minutes ago, Rump3L said:

@Radu  well, actually there is a possibility of a collab with someone if the time starts pressuring me. Aight, will do once ready, ty!

 

@Lizard Thanks man, nice tip. So my guess is basically to either stick with snowfall and make env light a bit brighter but also depend more on the warmness of street lights or to abandon the snowfall effect, have an actual moon and make env light a bit more brighter but colder? Because I feel like a certain deal of moonlight gets lost in the density of snowfall and sky. Atm the pitch is on -90 btw

You should go with either straight down angle or a bit altered. I would go with snow on the ground and full moon. This way you can have bright map because of the ambient light bouncing from the snow + some cool warm lights from the street lights.

Look at de_rails by Deh0lise:

it is super bright even tho its a night map. Here its mostly bright because of the full moon and snow only makes it brighter because of the contrast compared to the walls and everything else. You could go with a bit darker environment light and make the ambient light from snow do the work. Let me know if that makes sense.

Edited June 23, 2020 by Lizard

[Rump3L]

 

@Lizard I think I get what you mean by that. Took a look around on de_rails and yeah its having this forementioned cold-oriented contrast that makes one feel its super bright, but I feel like it still doesnt have such a strong visibility anyway due to the chosen wall textures when in the shadow.

 

Actually the first image for Freya that popped up in my mind was having  'snow on the ground & some horizontaly oriented surfaces + night snowfall + street lights + variations of white wooden textures with red/blue wood trims & frames' that would give you this 'orange-pinky' warm snow feeling instead of a cold one. So by combining all of that I thought I might get away with it, even if having less bright env light than in the 'cold' approach. Personally, couldnt find any 'truly night' urban snowfall map so far, so thats what got me up.

 

Sth like this (right pic is from a street in Stavanger in Norway, where you have quite an amount of bright wall materials and street light sources) 

I think for the fun of it the best will be to take a small outdoor part of the map, apply both approaches of env setting separately, quickly texture snow and white wood textures, add a few street lights and compare it. Based on that eventually making a decision.

 

Anyways, thanks a lot for taking the time and expressing your suggestions! Regardless of which approach I'll choose eventually, already turned up a bit the env brightness and updated imgs in the first post. Feels a bit better already imo. For comparison, here

 

Cheers

[Lizard]

Yeah rails is old map from when no one complained about visibility i think  

I really like the left one and I think you have a good foundation for this one with the environment light right now. It will be even a bit brighter once you add these warm street lamps. Keep up the good work! 

[Rump3L]

Ola, so I did the comparison and decided to do a little theme basis too. Might be using mixed inspirations from Bergen and Stavanger. Still feel more leaned towards the warm approach. What and why would your choice be here?

[Freaky_Banana]

I like the colder lighting a lot better. There are already fairly many maps with warm lighting, and I personally associate it with a warmer climate, which obviously you aren't going for. I also really like the contrast between warm lighting in houses and cold lighting once you step outside. Makes everything feel crisper to me and helps the player distinguish areas and feel the theme every time they walk outside. 

My only concern would be how good it actually feels while playing. Cold lighting isn't particularly inviting, so make sure to spread enough warm spots (like the little lamps showcased in your screenshots) around the outsides of the map as well. 

Edited July 9, 2020 by Freaky_Banana

[Rump3L]

@Freaky_Banana Thanks for your input man   So I took your advice while still wanting to keep that snowing effect. Made the brightness light less saturated, ambient colder and lamps boosted up a bit more. Kind of merging both approaches into eachother. Its just like Im really reluctant to let go of the snowfall idea and try to find ways to keep it 

[Lizard]

9 hours ago, Rump3L said:

Ola, so I did the comparison and decided to do a little theme basis too. Might be using mixed inspirations from Bergen and Stavanger. Still feel more leaned towards the warm approach. What and why would your choice be here?

To be honest I like the left one a lot better BUT... You would need to have a good contrast with indoor areas. Right now they have almost the same color value. Another thing is that it will drain the visual stamina of the players. Their eyes will get tired a lot quicker with dim lighting like this. And because of that reason I would go with the right one + have some street lights with the warm color like on the left so you end up with warm spots like on the left.

[Radu]

I would recommend a compromise between the two. Left is too warm, right is too cold. Aim for something in between. But if you had to choose, definitely pick the warmer option. People are more attracted to it. Also, don't be afraid to introduce more vibrant colours to draw attention to entrances or highlight paths. It could be a good opportunity to colour code some areas. Just look at Deathloop for some inspiration.

[Lizard]

2 hours ago, Radu said:

But if you had to choose, definitely pick the warmer option. People are more attracted to it.

I would say it applies to the environment more than light color values.

[Rump3L]

@Radu @Lizard  I decided to keep the snowfall at all costs now and trying to balance between the two approaches. So still keeping just a bit the warmness of snow, yet having this contrast of colder unlit vertical surfaces and warm streetlights, therefore reducing the strain. Nice ref pic though too warm env for my map imo, but the lights seem cool, might play around more with those street lights (and maybe a bit different type of indoor light sources too).

 

So I landed here so far as Ive shown in my last post and will try to tweak around that

3 hours ago, Rump3L said:

 

Thanks a lot for the support so far guys,  cool stuff !

[Lizard]

Keep in mind that you can also play with the textures to bring more "warm" to your map. Light will bounce from the walls and have different color values. Keep it up!