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Lizard

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5 minutes ago, Lizard said:

And I would rather talk about it because maybe the person giving the feedback will come to the conclusion that he didn't know about something before giving the feedback and next time he will take this experience into consideration. It's like going to the playtests and saying that the door should be THIS wide just because. And maybe at some point someone will talk about the reasons why the doors on his map are in this size.  And the guy will go "ohh I didn't think of that". Its more about taking feedback and giving something in exchange rather than taking everything for yourself and saying "thank you".

They risk of doing this, is that people will think you’re arguing with them. That’s what I’m trying to explain. Simply thanking someone for their feedback and then crumpling it up and throwing it in the trash, means they will still be willing to give you feedback long into the future. If it seems like you’re arguing with someone about that person’s opinion, it comes across as really hostile and makes them less likely to take the time to give you feedback in the future. 

Unless you think someone’s feedback is just dog shit, it’s usually not a good idea to come across as not being interested in their feedback. Someone can make a dumb point one day and a great point the next day. You want people to be willing to give you lots of feedback, everyone knows it’s up to you what feedback you take or do not take.

All of this is just my personal opinion.

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1 minute ago, FMPONE said:

They risk of doing this, is that people will think you’re arguing with them. That’s what I’m trying to explain. Simply thanking someone for their feedback and then crumpling it up and throwing it in the trash, means they will still be willing to give you feedback long into the future. If it seems like you’re arguing with someone about that person’s opinion, it comes across as really hostile and makes them less likely to take the time to give feedback in the future. 

Maybe the problem is that we are doing this via forum and you can't really judge the persons attitude. I really didn't mean to argue on that matter at all or being defensive.

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3 minutes ago, Lizard said:

Maybe the problem is that we are doing this via forum and you can't really judge the persons attitude. I really didn't mean to argue on that matter at all or being defensive.

Agreed, text can be really challenging. It makes things seem more cold and less friendly for sure. But I think Mapcore is a friendly place regardless :)

Good luck with your project dude! 

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I kind of agree with Shawn to an extant. I dont think anyone would try to argue that you need to pick 1 specific town and only use that for references, but just using "rural America" is way too wide of a net to cast. To me it would sort of be like early games that would just make a level set in general Asia with no 1 specific country in mind. The result is that you got the theme across and most people wont care, but people who live there will be confused by the strange mix of cultures that dont really go together.

Same thing applies here. If you just pull from anything that can be considered "rural America" you'll get the point across to players, but people who live in America will know somethings off. And yes obviously the CSGO playerbase isnt exactly a group to care about how accurate a theme is but I dont think thats an excuse not to try to make the theme believable. I think youll get a more consistent feel if you narrow it down to 1 specific state and take reference from there. Everything you've done far certainly feels like a Montana/Oregon type town. You could maybe make Indiana work as well. The main problem im seeing comes from both the houses and the trailer park as presented.

Trailers dont look like that, anywhere in the US. I get that you might just be using a place holder material, but that type of metal is not wasted on mobile homes. Likewise you'd be hard pressed to find a trailer park thats as run down as you've presented but also has a concrete foundation for nearly every trailer. But while Trailer Parks are pretty ubiquitous to any US state those houses are not. You would be hard pressed to find those houses in any rural area, let alone ones that feature buildings like what you've shown. Those type of houses are generally found in newer suburbs in large groups. Not in older rural towns. And yes both of those are nitpicking but as someone who lives in America I know those things dont look right.

Something similar to these houses are about what youd see in a rural area in America.

5bbea10f313f7.image.jpg.bb516aeb58f776795ba369b4eeaca69f.jpg

 

You cant really take a house from northern Maine and make it work in southern Arizona. Likewise you cant take a house from just anywhere in rural America and expect it to just work in any area. For instance, houses in Rural Montana tend to be flatter and have a wider area while houses in Rural Iowa tend to be longer and have more focus on strong foundation and basement with little or no second story. They are both designed this way to account for the weather that affects those 2 very different states.

Now granted it could be if you threw all the elements youve shown into a layout and terrain they might work better, I imagine there some missing element we arnt seeing that could tie all these together.

I am how ever concerned about gameplay in the haunted house. A 3 story house with multiple tiny windows for people to snipe out of on every floor coupled with inconsistent dark lighting through out the complex will not lend it self to fun gameplay. In my own DZ map I had a 2 story building with lots of windows to shoot from and a darker interior, it just didnt work because people on the outside would never be able to realistically counter people on the inside who could come from any number of windows. Unless the haunted house is the center piece building equivalent to the Kasbah on Sirocco or the Military Base on Blacksite I dont think it could really think its going to work outside of a major overhaul to gameplay and visual design.

 

In any-case you're a very talented artist and im sure it will at the very least look great when the final product is released.

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11 hours ago, fewseb said:

I kind of agree with Shawn to an extant. I dont think anyone would try to argue that you need to pick 1 specific town and only use that for references, but just using "rural America" is way too wide of a net to cast. To me it would sort of be like early games that would just make a level set in general Asia with no 1 specific country in mind. The result is that you got the theme across and most people wont care, but people who live there will be confused by the strange mix of cultures that dont really go together.

I think the issue here is that me as your typical european I have certain image of 'rural usa' formed by movies, pictures. These locations are representation of what I see when I think about rural part of usa. Shawn and you live in usa so for you guys the image of this part might be totally different. 

As for the gameplay aspect it will all comes to playtesting. Each building is built in such way I can close each room/window without much effort.

 

7 hours ago, Minos said:

It looks pretty cool Lizard! Just make whatever you are happy with, it's your own world and your own imagination :) 

Thank you Minos! I'm having so much fun compared to making typical de_ maps for csgo. 

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This map is looking incredible so far! Personally, I would replace some of the more recognizable Valve assets with custom ones (although that's something only mappers will recognize). More clutter may actually work well in this environment too. Either way, this map is shaping up to be very interesting. 👌

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8 hours ago, Wintrius said:

This map is looking incredible so far! Personally, I would replace some of the more recognizable Valve assets with custom ones (although that's something only mappers will recognize). More clutter may actually work well in this environment too. Either way, this map is shaping up to be very interesting. 👌

Thank You! We will replace some of the bigger assets from valve to our custom models. As for the more clutter... I want to see how the map performs with minimal level of detail and then add more rather than cut content because the fps is low but I agree :D Would love to see more smaller details!

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Although I'm unsure what state this map is meant to take place in, a mountainous Skybox resembling a Midwestern state such as the Dakotas or Wyoming may be really fitting.

It'd be especially cozy if the Skybox were similar to what's seen on Trailerpark:

Spoiler

20200725021028_1.jpg.037f52314f1a375f263261a74ea70737.jpg

If the map were to occupy such a region, fire outlook towers may be suitable as well.

Spoiler

Firewatch inspired a fan to become youngest fire tower historian ...

This type of structure would fit incredibly well in a Danger Zone setting.

Your choice of course, but just some small ideas to consider.

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4 hours ago, Wintrius said:

Although I'm unsure what state this map is meant to take place in, a mountainous Skybox resembling a Midwestern state such as the Dakotas or Wyoming may be really fitting.

It'd be especially cozy if the Skybox were similar to what's seen on Trailerpark:

  Hide contents

20200725021028_1.jpg.037f52314f1a375f263261a74ea70737.jpg

If the map were to occupy such a region, fire outlook towers may be suitable as well.

  Hide contents

Firewatch inspired a fan to become youngest fire tower historian ...

This type of structure would fit incredibly well in a Danger Zone setting.

Your choice of course, but just some small ideas to consider.

For all the natural land features this is definitely the kind of setting I'm trying to emulate. An outlook tower is a great idea btw, thanks! Somehow I was so focused on our FC5 references I completely forgot about Firewatch.

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