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Mocherad

Source 1 and 2018 year

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Hi plebs, let's talk about Source 1 today, I haven't large experience in Source 1, but after the work which I saw here, I'm very MOTIVATED!!! Some levels look like better than some of the Valves official CS:GO/TF 2 maps.

As I know Valve will make CS:GO on the Source 2, and we will use the new Hammer and else new actual tools. So what to do now, wait for the new and actual tools with Source 2 for map makers, or start to learning old Source 1?

How is the old Hammer hard to learn, do I need to waste a lot of time to understand how this tool is working, understand known bugs and issues etc. How do you think, do I need to waste a time for about few months if soon we will get a new engine, and this knowledge will be not actual. To be fair, I think is too late for learning so old hammer. But what do you think?

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4 hours ago, Squad said:

Source 2 was announced in March 2015 and, 3 years later, here we are. CSGO is not (yet?) ported to Source 2 and there is no reason to assume that will happen anytime soon. 
If you're new to level design in general, just go for it. Source SDK is relatively easy to get started in and there's a ton of information/tutorials/games for it out there.

Level design is more than knowing an editor, so any time spent in one is not wasted at all.

 

Yes, you are right, from 2015, but there wasn't any announcement that Valve plans to make CS GO on Source 2, they were talking about Dota 2, and Dota 2 was moved on the Source 2 after 6 months. Only in the end of 2017, we can find some insider info.

How many time you think I need to learn in CS GO hammer, level design(looks like easy) + other parts, render setting, materials, source formats, game logic, physics all?  

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40 minutes ago, Minos said:

Just go for it, don't overthink and enjoy making and playing your own maps :) There's no right or wrong way.

 Yeah, creating levels from 2012 y. my first level in the Unity 3D 2013 year, you can find it here - https://www.artstation.com/mocherad

I'm asking because want to know, how many time it can take from me ) So I need to choose between CryEngine and Hammer Editor, tbh I think I need to focus on CryEngine and invest time on this game engine than the Hammer. And I 'm sure this year we will see CS GO on the Source 2 beta

 

I was watching some tutorials, looks like an easy engine, but I don't like it, looks like very old. Don't see the reason to make maps in the old hammer this is more like for the old school guys, who are working on it few years. Realy don't like how it works (old Hammer), too old for me! Not enough motivation to waste time on this too old editor. The feeling so bad, as I switched from windows 10 to windows 98 if you know what I mean.... ))

Thank you for your answers, I feel sorry for my decision! I hope you will be not angry at me! 

Edited by Mocherad

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To be honest, even if Source is "old-school", that mentality of keeping geometry simple instead of sculpting and kitbashing everything in zbrush will give you a solid foundation to become a better environment artist in general. I feel that the way I work on Overwatch is still very similar to the way I worked on Half-Life 1 maps, I just have more tools at my disposal now, but the foundation is basically the same!

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On 3/15/2018 at 5:22 PM, Mocherad said:

How many time you think I need to learn in CS GO hammer, level design(looks like easy) + other parts, render setting, materials, source formats, game logic, physics all?  

You should ask yourself what you want.

Do you actually want to make Maps for CS:GO/TF2/Portal2/L4D2/HL2 etc.? Maps that are fun to play and look great? Make maps that actually are played by people, maybe get added to a CS:GO Operation? Or just want to focus on gameplay, want to test some ideas or whatever?

-> start now!

Or do you just want to mess around with a modern 3d Engine, get good looking results fast.

-> Maybe it's better to forget about Source Engine. And use something else like UE, CryEngine etc.

 

The Hammer Editor itself is pretty simple and fast to learn, but it takes a lot of time to create good looking maps. It's hard to say how long it will take you to handle the editor (some people learn fast, others slower), but if you are willing to spend something like 100 hrs just to learn the editor/engine, you are fine, I think.

The more time consuming part is learning how to create assets (models, textures etc., but this is not made in Hammer of course),  and how to put things together so that it looks good.

If you want to make maps for CS:GO, the (by far) most challenging part is (imo) to create a good layout. I personally started to make CS maps in 2000, made a break ~2003-2012, but all in all it's been some years now. And I still have absolutely no idea what I'm doing.

Edited by Radix

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Thanks guys, I'm focusing now on the Source 2, CryEngine 5 and Unreal Engine. I'm sure that very soon we will see new hammer for CS GO, so i keep waiting for it

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3 hours ago, Mocherad said:

I'm focusing now on the Source 2, CryEngine 5 and Unreal Engine.

That's so much "focusing", it's not focusing at all.

Remember this, tools are just tools. When you wanna hammer a nail, you use ONE hammer, and hit that nail as many times as needed, right?. You don't hit the nail once with a hammer, hit the nail again with a different hammer, and then again with an even different hammer. That's exactly what you're doing by spreading yourself so thin with so many tools. What's the point?

Choose a tool, and cater what you do to the kinds of things that tool does best. In time, you'll know when it's time to leave that tool behind for something different.

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Source now hooks into 3dsmax really well, so you're not really limited to brushes anymore. You could make a map entirely out of 3d meshes although it would be best to stick to brushes for things like clipping, etc.

Source's major limitations are primarily with transparency. Foliage is expensive, smoke effects are expensive, glass is expensive. Simple shaders cause the engine to really go fucky. If transparency was cheap you'd hardly have any limitations at all. The primary issue I ran into with Sub-Zero was just the "hard-coded' brush limits when you want to take short-cuts on stuff instead of modelling it, or you want nice lighting (brushes light a bit more consistently than meshes). You can't go super high resolution on your textures, 1024x1024 is the mainstay for "nice", 2048x2048 looks great but it's not really viable most of the time because you'll hit hard-limits and performance limits.

Overall, Wall-Worm powered Source is just a bridge to 3dsmax at this point, with some overhead from having to compile (that's where it can be easy to hit seemingly random limits if you're doing anything ambitious). Source isn't a powerful engine by modern standards but it's serviceable for CS:GO at least.

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> Ask for insights.

> Get advices from the pros in the industry.

> Make the total opposite of what they've said.

 

Bruhhhh

Edited by RaVaGe

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16 hours ago, [HP] said:

That's so much "focusing", it's not focusing at all.

Remember this, tools are just tools. When you wanna hammer a nail, you use ONE hammer, and hit that nail as many times as needed, right?. You don't hit the nail once with a hammer, hit the nail again with a different hammer, and then again with an even different hammer. That's exactly what you're doing by spreading yourself so thin with so many tools. What's the point?

Choose a tool, and cater what you do to the kinds of things that tool does best. In time, you'll know when it's time to leave that tool behind for something different.

I'm fine with Source 2, I have few years exp., also I have some paid work in the Source 2, some guy hired me from mapcore. 

CryEngine - I plan to work at Crytek Kiev this year, they need some experience in the CryEngine.

Unreal Engine for personal gamedevelopment.

8 hours ago, RaVaGe said:

> Ask for insights.

> Get advices from the pros in the industry.

> Make the total opposite of what they've said.

 

Bruhhhh

I totally agree with them, but there is a insider information that this year CS:GO will be ported to the same Hammer which I'm using in Source 2, so in my situation i will just wait for it (HODL)

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Just saying man, if I could go back in time to slap my old self on the back of the head for obsessing over learning ALL the tools because that's what he thought would get him to mastery, I would...

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22 hours ago, Mocherad said:

 

I totally agree with them, but there is a insider information that this year CS:GO will be ported to the same Hammer which I'm using in Source 2, so in my situation i will just wait for it (HODL)

Lmao. No. Just no.

If this happens, I will eat your shoes. You can send them to me in the post and I’ll eat them on camera

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