[WIP] de_meat [Looking for gameplay feedback]

[Tyker]

Hey everyone!

After lurking for 4 years it's time to post my first CSGO map on mapcore!

Me and Codename 22 present you: de_meat. A bomb defuse map placed in an American slaughterhouse.

The Anarchists want to destroy the slaughterhouse and cripple the production of meat.
The T's can either blow up the shipping trucks where the meat is sent off, or they can blow up a freezer in the cellar to collapse the entire building.
The CT's of course try everything to prevent this.

The screenshots below are VERY OLD INDEED! For updated screenshots, check the last posts in this thread or the workshop link above!

Screenshots:

T Spawn

A Site

B Site

Mid

Connector

CT Spawn

 

Overview

Overview with callouts

Workshop:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=481597483

We've made this map in 2 months, specifically because of the contest, and it was our first big collaboration on a map!  We both developed the design and worked on the set dressing. This was a very good experience which we both learned a lot from. In the future we might make a video of all the iterations which the map went through (a lot!) so you guys can get an insight into the process we went through.

It has been playtested with a variety of skills, from silver 3 to global elite, and everything in between! The balance seems to be about 45% CT 55% T. If you are planning on playing the map, or have played it, we would love to hear from you and get a demo to view!

Enjoy!

Full Credits:
Storm (Robin-Yann Storm) - Leveldesign + Setdressing
Codename 22 (Arie Gijsenbergh) - Leveldesign + Setdressing
Miss Stabby (Rachel van der Meer) - Skinningmachine model + texture
Ian van der Mijn - Meathookrailing model
Senzo van Gastel - Hozers model + Meatcart model + Toiletdividers model
Emily Cheung - Model Texture for Hozer + Meatcart + Toiletdividers + Meathookrailing

 

Edited December 6, 2015 by Tyker
info

[laminutederire]

Judging from your screenshots, it looks visually varied, which is good to know where you are. However CT spawn seems very dark!

Judging from the overview,  it very crooked, and just for that I am interested to play it, it isn't a classic squarey map ala dust2!

I'm sorry my feedback won't be useful for the version you're submitting for the contest,  but tomorrow I'll hop in and I'll post here to give my thoughts.

Good luck!

[Tyker]

Today I spent learning how to do smoothing for source demos. Here's a flythrough of de_meat!

[laminutederire]

As promised, here are my thoughts:

To begin with, the most important thing to fix in my opinion is the bomb plant on the truck at B, it give a major disadvantage for retakes which would be game breaking in my opinion. I guess this should have already been discussed, so I think it is intentional on your part, and I don't like it!

Second thing that bugged me is the fact that mid felt to me as a bit messy visually, but I could get used to it!

To make a transition, A is a bit complex, the CT part has some paths that need to be simplified. I'm thinking of the tight corridor connecting CT spawn to the upper CT mid area, it could easily be removed to allow more space on the site surroundings. However, some might say that it isn't good, because too complex, I'd say that I like it, there are a few interesting ways to play it, and that's what the game is all about.

I like the fact that areas have different styles, which help orientation, to perfect this, I'd rework the only redundancy which is the looks of A long and the connector to upper B. The easiest way would be to retexture the part of the connector which isn't very large and shouldn't require a lot of work.

Finally, this map offers some kind of variety of playstyles, which is great. Good work!

 

PS: toilet texture is weird

Edit: I forgot to mention it, but for some reason bots were talking about hostages at the beginning of each round, which is odd for a defuse map!

Edited August 31, 2015 by laminutederire

[Bodd Jonar]

I work in a slaughterhouse, so this was a fun theme  Even tho it doesn't look like a real slaughterhouse, I guess you either choose gameplay over a realistic look or you  don't work in one, but I still love the theme. I can't really tell what type of animal is being slaughtered in there, by the height of the building I would guess pig or lamb (the roof would need to be 5-6m tall to slaughter cow), but then the crooks don't seem to fit. And who leaves blood on the floor after the production has ended for the day?  If there is gonna be blood, there should also be blood on the walls, because the blood gets all over the place, this is the cleanest slaughterhouse I have ever seen. 

I could talk for hours about this, but I understand that even what you have done is impressive, modeling alone to make a realistic slaughterhouse would take thousands of hours, and getting that gritty look of a real slaughterhouse is not possible with the source engine. 

 

I would love for there to be dead animals somewhere, but I guess such a map would be short lived. 

Sorry for being a smartass, as I said, I love the theme.

 

 

Edited August 31, 2015 by Bodd Jonar

[Tyker]

As promised, here are my thoughts:

To begin with, the most important thing to fix in my opinion is the bomb plant on the truck at B, it give a major disadvantage for retakes which would be game breaking in my opinion. I guess this should have already been discussed, so I think it is intentional on your part, and I don't like it!

Second thing that bugged me is the fact that mid felt to me as a bit messy visually, but I could get used to it!

To make a transition, A is a bit complex, the CT part has some paths that need to be simplified. I'm thinking of the tight corridor connecting CT spawn to the upper CT mid area, it could easily be removed to allow more space on the site surroundings. However, some might say that it isn't good, because too complex, I'd say that I like it, there are a few interesting ways to play it, and that's what the game is all about.

I like the fact that areas have different styles, which help orientation, to perfect this, I'd rework the only redundancy which is the looks of A long and the connector to upper B. The easiest way would be to retexture the part of the connector which isn't very large and shouldn't require a lot of work.

Finally, this map offers some kind of variety of playstyles, which is great. Good work!

 

PS: toilet texture is weird

Edit: I forgot to mention it, but for some reason bots were talking about hostages at the beginning of each round, which is odd for a defuse map!

Thanks for the feedback! 

With the bomb plant on truck B, do you mean inside the truck or on top of the truck? We haven't ever had someone plant on top of the truck so that would explain why we never caught that problem.

Yes, the connector to upper B and A long look the same. We did this to make the player understand they are in a transition area, but I like your point of it being repetitive. 

With the weird toilet texture, do you mean the walls, the model or both?

I can't fix anything right now because the contest deadline is done, but when the contest is over I can fix this stuff you mentioned!

I work in a slaughterhouse, so this was a fun theme  Even tho it doesn't look like a real slaughterhouse, I guess you either choose gameplay over a realistic look or you  don't work in one, but I still love the theme. I can't really tell what type of animal is being slaughtered in there, by the height of the building I would guess pig or lamb (the roof would need to be 5-6m tall to slaughter cow), but then the crooks don't seem to fit. And who leaves blood on the floor after the production has ended for the day?  If there is gonna be blood, there should also be blood on the walls, because the blood gets all over the place, this is the cleanest slaughterhouse I have ever seen. 

I could talk for hours about this, but I understand that even what you have done is impressive, modeling alone to make a realistic slaughterhouse would take thousands of hours, and getting that gritty look of a real slaughterhouse is not possible with the source engine. 

 

I would love for there to be dead animals somewhere, but I guess such a map would be short lived. 

Sorry for being a smartass, as I said, I love the theme.

 

 

Yes, we chose gameplay over realism in a lot of areas! We did read up about slaughterhouses when planning the map, and a big inspiration was this image, but of course that is so much equipment that mid would become much too large and cluttered for a CSGO map! 

The blood would indeed be cleaned up, but we used it for gameplay purposes to guide the player a long with the red line on the meathook rails. Also, it breaks up the white colour scheme very nicely. The reason why we do not have actual dead animals is: We don't know whether that is allowed on the workshop. Dead chickens are in the files, but a split open cow might be over the limit? I don't want to be in risk of getting removed or banned!

I never read about the 5-6m roof rule for cattle, even though we did read through slaugthterhouse rules, plans and saw documentaries. We also really wanted to include the Temple Grandin cattle chutes but those things are way too big for a CSGO map! Considering we intended the map to be in a cattle slaughterhouse, I would love to know more if you could tell me why that 5-6m roof rule exists!

Edited September 1, 2015 by Tyker

[laminutederire]

 

I meant on top of the truck, I can make a screenshot if you want  And I was talking about the walls !

Sounds like a good plan, waiting on the updates then

[Bodd Jonar]

 

I never read about the 5-6m roof rule for cattle, even though we did read through slaugthterhouse rules, plans and saw documentaries. We also really wanted to include the Temple Grandin cattle chutes but those things are way too big for a CSGO map! Considering we intended the map to be in a cattle slaughterhouse, I would love to know more if you could tell me why that 5-6m roof rule exists!

It is no rule haha.  It is just needed for the cows to hang straight without touching the floor. A cow is pretty long when it hangs in its feet, while the head hangs under it towards the floor. When slaughtering cows you don't use the crooks in the map, you use one separate crook for ever feet, so that you can saw the body in half. like in this picture, notice the crooks: http://g02.s.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1a2DpIXXXXXXYXXXXq6xXFXXXL/Slaughter-House-CaseCattle-Abattoir-Half-Carcass-Band.jpg

I understand the blood etc and the simplification, you don't need to change anything.

[Tyker]

Thanks Bodd! Depending on the timing of the contest we might be able to adapt those hooks!

Edit: I forgot to mention it, but for some reason bots were talking about hostages at the beginning of each round, which is odd for a defuse map!

I forgot to mention this earlier: I have no idea why that is the case. There are no hostage entities around, and yet the anarchists talk about hostages anyway. No other T team seems to do that, but they do. If anyone knows why that happens or how to solve it, please let me know!

[laminutederire]

Probably because the only official map they're in is office,  and it's an hostage map.

There wasn't this issue with Marquis though if I remember correctly.. mystery but that's not very important, it is funny the first few times and after that, well I forgot about it

[Vaya]

you might be able to specify in the kv file what voices you want to use.

[Mark C.]

This theme scares me... 

[ics]

Theme of this map can be described with one word. Creepy.

[Tyker]

you might be able to specify in the kv file what voices you want to use.

I cannot find any information about that when searching around. Do you have any more information or was that a guess?

[Vaya]

I cannot find any information about that when searching around. Do you have any more information or was that a guess?

guess. I'll see if I can find any info myself