[CSGO] Good map rotation times

[Muffin]

What rotation times should a good CS:GO map have?

 

Most official maps keep the fast rotates around 15 seconds or less. But what exactly should a nice balanced map have rotation wise?

Edited March 10, 2015 by InfinitySlayerX

[Demolitions]

What rotation times should a good CS:GO map have?

 

Most official maps keep the fast rotates around 10 seconds or less. But what exactly should a nice balanced map have rotation wise?

 

Which maps have 10 seconds or less? I've only seen close to 15

[Muffin]

 

What rotation times should a good CS:GO map have?

 

Most official maps keep the fast rotates around 10 seconds or less. But what exactly should a nice balanced map have rotation wise?

 

Which maps have 10 seconds or less? I've only seen close to 15

 

Cache, Dust 2 is close, meh... lol, your right. "15 Seconds", will edit OP.

[Muffin]

But what do you guys think is a good balanced rotation time, not by Vavles standards, but by a players perspective.

[flexsta]

just my 2 cents;
I think the rotation times are very relative to the rest of the map proportions, I mean how would you define rotation times for de_nuke, for example?
That said I think on a more generic layout I'd say the the 10-15 seconds are a fairly good starting point.

[Vaya]

It totally depends on what you have on the route too. You can't say it's 10 seconds rotation if during actual gameplay you have 10 possible encounter spots on the rotation route...

[ShockaPop]

Few things you should consider keeping in mind when thinking about that rotation time:

 

*How dangerous is the rotation from site-to-site (if you have to check tons of corners and spots on the way, it takes time).

*Bomb ticks 45 seconds in Valve's regular Matchmaking, 35 seconds in FaceIt/ESEA/etc.

*Defusing the bomb takes 5 or 10 seconds, depending if player has defuse-kit or not.

*How many hiding-spots there are in the immediate bomb-site you have to go and check out specifically to be sure enemy isn't in close range.

*How complicated the site is in terms of cover so fights don't turn into cat-and-mouse even if the other one is pursuing best possible way.

 

Or, are you talking about rotation times for Terrorists: when changing tactics from just outside one site to another?

[Klems]

Well, it depends on the map. Usually, lower than 10 is a bit too fast, bigger than 20 is really too much.

 

It's mainly a balance problem, the time itself isn't that important (as long as it's not absurd).

Stick with the "risk = reward" formula. If both teams rotate through their spawns (= safe), the CTs should have the advantage. However, if the Ts are in control of the map (= risk), then they should have the advantage.

See: middle on Dust2, banana on Inferno, vents on Nuke, etc.

[OrnateBaboon]

I wrote the averages down a while ago in a text document.

 

Dust 2 - 15.78 secs
Inferno - 13. 82 secs
Cache - 12. 32 secs
Train - 10. 74 secs
Mirage - 10. 66 secs
Nuke - 7. 99 secs

[blackdog]

Personally I would expect that for a short rotation time the bombsite will have better cover and will be more difficult to retake, vice versa long rotation time a slimmer bombsite.

 

I'm just considering going through the "main" rotation path (of course going back to your spawn should be safe and take extra long time).

 

Does that make any sense?

[unremarkable player]

That isn't necessarily the case with Mirage. It's a fair bit smaller than Dust and smaller than Cache and the rotation times are very fast. B > Window is 10-11 seconds, B > CT > A is more like 15 seconds, B > Short > Connector is like 9-10 seconds. Mirage doesn't give a great deal of cover in A for retaking or protecting bomb and given its openness, can be quite easy to retake.

 

 

just my 2 cents;
I think the rotation times are very relative to the rest of the map proportions, I mean how would you define rotation times for de_nuke, for example?
That said I think on a more generic layout I'd say the the 10-15 seconds are a fairly good starting point.

 

You really can't get any better advice than that. The new Season map has a lot of pathways and possible rotations and so does Overpass. Even Inferno has several rotations that allow for good flanking maneuvers. The paths should make sense in the context of the map, rather than just an open alley way or space between buildings. Cobble for instance was simplified because it simply had too many paths to no where, or the same place, and it made defending or attacking virtually impossible because of all the paths. The rotation times were absurd unless you went direct from A > B through doors, but no one did that because it was suicide.

 

1. Keep it simple, focus on 1-2 primary paths to each site, and

2. Connect the lanes.

 

What I think the rule of thumb should be:

A player must be able to rotate from one site to another and have time to defuse without a kit on a 30 second timer. Rotations should be maximum of 15 seconds to allow for smokes, organisation, flashes and combat. Anything exceeding 15 seconds makes a defuse without a kit impossible and improbable with a kit. Anything less than 10 seconds makes it impossible for a defending team to keep the site, whereas 10-15 seconds makes it possible. Ideally, 12-14 seconds gives a very good balance either way. Both teams can attack and defend and the CTs have time to defuse without a kit and have time to setup with nades.

 

You also have to think about how players will want to protect the bomb. Mirage A is typically protected or retaken from CT, B from shop or chair, D2 A from ramp or long, Inferno B from new box or A from pit etc.

Edited March 11, 2015 by unremarkable player

[Bodd Jonar]

Few things you should consider keeping in mind when thinking about that rotation time:

 

*How dangerous is the rotation from site-to-site (if you have to check tons of corners and spots on the way, it takes time).

*Bomb ticks 45 seconds in Valve's regular Matchmaking, 35 seconds in FaceIt/ESEA/etc.

*Defusing the bomb takes 5 or 10 seconds, depending if player has defuse-kit or not.

*How many hiding-spots there are in the immediate bomb-site you have to go and check out specifically to be sure enemy isn't in close range.

*How complicated the site is in terms of cover so fights don't turn into cat-and-mouse even if the other one is pursuing best possible way.

 

Or, are you talking about rotation times for Terrorists: when changing tactics from just outside one site to another?

 

I think this is what makes Dust2 so good. The long rotate times, the fact that T can watch CT rotate and the way the bombsites are made, The fact that A-site is "above" the rotate path makes that bombsite very special, and B is just hell to enter as CT. 

[Vaya]

 

Few things you should consider keeping in mind when thinking about that rotation time:

 

*How dangerous is the rotation from site-to-site (if you have to check tons of corners and spots on the way, it takes time).

*Bomb ticks 45 seconds in Valve's regular Matchmaking, 35 seconds in FaceIt/ESEA/etc.

*Defusing the bomb takes 5 or 10 seconds, depending if player has defuse-kit or not.

*How many hiding-spots there are in the immediate bomb-site you have to go and check out specifically to be sure enemy isn't in close range.

*How complicated the site is in terms of cover so fights don't turn into cat-and-mouse even if the other one is pursuing best possible way.

 

Or, are you talking about rotation times for Terrorists: when changing tactics from just outside one site to another?

 

I think this is what makes Dust2 so good. The long rotate times, the fact that T can watch CT rotate and the way the bombsites are made, The fact that A-site is "above" the rotate path makes that bombsite very special, and B is just hell to enter as CT. 

 

1.6 used to be a lot better for  taking B. door was flipped so you could check car and then use window to check backplat. No idea what the door was flipped

[Muffin]

Few things you should consider keeping in mind when thinking about that rotation time:

*How dangerous is the rotation from site-to-site (if you have to check tons of corners and spots on the way, it takes time).

*Bomb ticks 45 seconds in Valve's regular Matchmaking, 35 seconds in FaceIt/ESEA/etc.

*Defusing the bomb takes 5 or 10 seconds, depending if player has defuse-kit or not.

*How many hiding-spots there are in the immediate bomb-site you have to go and check out specifically to be sure enemy isn't in close range.

*How complicated the site is in terms of cover so fights don't turn into cat-and-mouse even if the other one is pursuing best possible way.

Or, are you talking about rotation times for Terrorists: when changing tactics from just outside one site to another?

I think this is what makes Dust2 so good. The long rotate times, the fact that T can watch CT rotate and the way the bombsites are made, The fact that A-site is "above" the rotate path makes that bombsite very special, and B is just hell to enter as CT.

1.6 used to be a lot better for taking B. door was flipped so you could check car and then use window to check backplat. No idea what the door was flipped Maybe it's because Valve wanted players to enter B site with cover against players playing car. How ironic

Edited March 11, 2015 by Muffin