[CSGO] [WIP] de_whatever (temporary name)

[Ammy]

Workshop link: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=399160784

 

so I've been working on this map since tuesday and I'd like to know what people here think needs to be changed. 

 

 

this is the radar image. For some reason the stairs are almost unrecognizable but whatever. The red box is a room, I put the outline so you could see it better. I'll take any feedback. (the maps theme will be the same as inferno because I can't make anything custom)

[Guni]

Do you think mid is a bit to close to T spawn yet further for CT, not to mention A site seems furthest away from CT's.

I'll take a look and edit this post on my opinion/thoughts.


*EDIT*

So I took some time to have a run around of your map and check it all out. Before i give feedback understand that these are merely my own opinions and I am not a professional on level design, also understand that I am not attacking you in any way, merely trying to give guidance.

Now with the legal matters out of the way, let's begin!

T-Spawn



So I couldn't really go into any detail with this spawn, it was basically a box, and i assume it merely existed as a point for spawning, not much thought thrown into it. I did find one area that i thought needed to be re-worked. It was the pathway from T-spawn to mid, you were able to prefire with an awp, or any weapon, straight at the peak point for CT. Pretty much easiest mid hold ever. My suggestion would to either move the pathway to the left more, or put in some cover and obstacles.

B-Site Pathway (T-Side)



Again its rather open and just blocky, I am assume once the layout and timings are done you will look at detailing and adding character to the sections. The space circled in red was kind of pointless in my opinion and does nothing at all. Just bring the wall in and create a single path.



As you move up closer to B site, there is an extremely narrow corridor, that leads into a rather big room before even entering B site. This forces a choke point where one is not needed, its way to small, its tight (like your sister) and it makes it hard for T's to get closer to site. Think about widening the path, and look at controlling the choke point in that room just after it, that will allow for smoother game-play.

B-Site



Playing from the balcony or top section you have a pretty strong angle for early pushes, I understand that T's can come in from that balcony as it was the short pathway in, however if its smoked well enough or controlled from a CT POV, it could be an OP position, maybe look at giving entrance cover, or nerfing something inside the corridor.



The entire site is just way to small, very small infact. Everything feels cluttered and the layout is un-natural and unforgiving. My personal suggestion would be to look at making the site larger, placing cover in the perfect spots and don't over use elements. The fountain should be a centre piece similar to Inferno's Site.



You missed a spot

Pathways and Connections



Your map consists of several pathways and inside area's that connect each site to mid and allow each team to attempt to use it to there advantage. The idea/principle behind it is nice, however the way it was executed felt forced. This room in the first screenshot serves no purpose besides a very dark aesthetic, there's no point going in there or holding it. If anything it will end up being a casual P90 hangout. If you want to use the room, give it some detail and function and have some form of flow from it, maybe a door-way that re-connects into the pathways, or access up to that door-way that leads to bridge.



This leads me to this, i understand that this was just a cosmetic thing. I would be interested in seeing how it fairs as a element you could include into your map but if you aren't going to allow it to be accessed, just add a prop with a door model and keep it at that.



This was the pathways into A site, and i will get to that site in a minute. The pathways felt a bit pointless, having both of them enter at pretty much the same location made using either invalid. My recommendation to you is to move the balcony up, so that it is just resting over the site, and push the door way a little bit closer to the site and give it some cover from the T-push, that way its not too strong for Mid pushes from CT's.

A-Site



So as i think you mentioned, and as I tested, the time for both teams to arrive at A was about 11-12 seconds, however it was a bit silly for a site. The site itself has way to many boxes, really big ones too, and by the time the ct gets into site, they can't even see the T's on the rush or have a location to setup to defend. Again the site was also rather small, or felt cluttered. Try looking at opening the sites up a bit more, and spread the boxes out. Also try using smaller boxes or brushes so that the feeling of space doesn't get too subtracted from the site. 'Less is more'.

Middle







I like where you were trying to go with mid, the cosmetic of the bridge from inferno gives it a nice feel, however the execution is lacking. I think you have to many stairs on the CT side, try flattening it out to a raised part of land with a staircase leading to the middle section if you are trying to add elements of height. Look at removing some of the clutter from those boxes and give both sides certain advantages and disadvantages for holding it. Look at using different types of architecture or brush work to give it potential.



This middle connector seemed annoying and pointless, to close to the B push for T's and that would become annoying for CT's to hold. If you still want a point from there, look at turning it into a window or something else. That way you don't force players to access it, however B-pushers have a one way ticket if they decide to push into Mid.

Manners



This last bit is more for your own personal growth and sanity. Through learning, frustration and repeated changes, it will be good for you to learn to map a little cleaner. Try to keep your brushes in-line with each other where possible, clean and neat will save you a lot of time and mental capacity.

Also a BIG technique you want to try learning and implementing is the use of NoDraw Textures. There is abundance of tutorials and resources on the net for NoDraw and its a rather easy technique to implement, its main purpose is to Block Vis Leafs and seal leaks on your map. It also prevents the compiler from building lightmaps on those faces and shortens compile times, and map resource use. Everybody wins

Conclusion

I think you have the core principal and layout down in your mind, i can see your train of thought and the thought process you went through when designing the map. I think with a bit of cleaning, polishing and changes the map could become stronger to play and enjoy. Just think about balance, flow and readability from a players perspective. Keep up the good work!

Edited February 27, 2015 by Guni

[Ammy]

Do you think mid is a bit to close to T spawn yet further for CT, not to mention A site seems furthest away from CT's.

I'll take a look and edit this post on my opinion/thoughts.

 

I was thinking of moving CT spawn closer to everything, actually. Just haven't been 100% sure so far, because it might make them too close to B. I've timed A site for both side and I think I got CTs there 2 seconds before Ts on the same spot each time.

[Ammy]

 

Here's what I quickly threw together for moving CT spawn forward. Haven't tested it yet, though.

 

Edit: I won't be able to publish the moved forward version of the map to the workshop for about 2 hours. I'll probably be back by then.

Edited February 27, 2015 by Ammy

[Guni]

 

Do you think mid is a bit to close to T spawn yet further for CT, not to mention A site seems furthest away from CT's.

I'll take a look and edit this post on my opinion/thoughts.

 

I was thinking of moving CT spawn closer to everything, actually. Just haven't been 100% sure so far, because it might make them too close to B. I've timed A site for both side and I think I got CTs there 2 seconds before Ts on the same spot each time.

 

 

 

 

Here's what I quickly threw together for moving CT spawn forward. Haven't tested it yet, though.

 

Edit: I won't be able to publish the moved forward version of the map to the workshop for about 2 hours. I'll probably be back by then.

Play around with things and I've updated my original post with some tips and thoughts. Happy Mapping

[Ammy]

Unfortunately I can't edit my map for the next 3 days (unless decompiling won't hurt the map too much (because it only messes up areaportals and displacements or something, right?)) so I'll get onto everything you've said when I can 

[Ammy]

Ok, an update:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/89k5un83f63bl40/bihwha.zip?dl=0

 

(zip download with map, no radar because i'm lazy and changing stuff a lot)

 

 

a few changes to B, mostly ones that you mentioned

 

 

changes to mid, I didn't really understand the bit you said about stairs so I just did this so both sides could snipe n stuff

 

 

couple of changes to A, all temporary cause nobody ever seems to want to go A. I guess the sexiness of the textures on B attract everyone I play with

 

 

 

 

blast from the past: a screenshot from a map I was working on from almost exactly a year ago, but gave up after realizing nobody actually likes hostage rescue

 

today also marks the point where my hours in the SDK go past my hours in csgo (283 vs 279)

[Bodd Jonar]

Why not use the new bridge from the updated inferno? Looks much better tbh. 

[skusmet]

If you give me some info / mood boards I can make you a bridge

[Ammy]

If you give me some info / mood boards I can make you a bridge

 

earlier on my friend was looking through some things and found out about trignac foundries or something like that and showed me this post on tumblr: http://leveldesigninspirationmachine.tumblr.com/post/111729855303/feeding-my-eyes-trignac-foundries-a-famous-place

 

I was planning on making it like that but I'm too lazy and impatient to learn how to use blender and programs like that so I just used inferno theme. unfortunately I have no money to pay so even if you can just point me to something that'd be cool

Edited March 3, 2015 by Ammy

[skusmet]

Don't worry not gonna ask for money for a model, if there's any specifics you want size wise etc let me know I'll whip something up before the weekend hopefully, depends how busy work is!

[Ammy]

well right now the gap is 176x320 units and 240 units tall, but it could probably go a bit taller than that

[skusmet]

Alright will see what I can do.

[skusmet]

Can you gimme any designs or references you want? Some styles etc? There's lots of kinds of bridges in the world, don't know where to start really

[Ammy]

i think i've thought of a theme: a sort of shanty town by the sea. the bridge should be built up like one of these houses http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Jakarta_slumlife66.JPGso its made up of multiple bits of metal and whatever other stuff. I don't really know if thats enough 

 

also just noticed the theme has kind of already been done by rush, but i dont think that matters?