Mac or PC ?

[Seldoon182]

Hi guys,

 

Far from awaking your old rancor on which is best between Mac or PC I think that we should pickup the right tool for the right need. Indeed I'm looking to buy a new computer and I know exactly what I want to do with and what I need. But even if I'm open minded I've got my personal experience and habits with computers.

 

I've always been on PC / Windows and I started recently using Linux (Mostly for Bitcoins and Kali linux). My first experience with Mac started when I was at Design school in 2007. OS X UI/UX was so awkward to me. Complicated, slow I didn't enjoyed that experience back theses years.

 

But time changed. Since then I had an iPhone and it reconciled me with Apple. I don't mean I'm pro or against Apple and I dunno agree with 100% of their policy but I really like the design they put on their product. They look simple, sleek, slim and comfortable to use. Even OS X Mavericks became more attractive to me and Yosemite finished to convince me.

 

So here we are. I need to buy a new computer. I need a laptop. I mostly need a computer to dev web apps and websites. So I barely need something that works with a browser and thousand of tabs opened, Sublime Text 2 and Adobe Creative Suite (Photoshop, Illustrator and After Effect for video) and I was thinking buying a.. Mac... for the first time. I've already been in an Apple store (I'm an iPhone owner) and I know that a PC is way cheaper and faster than any iMac and Mac Pro so it doesn't fit my need. But I'm looking for a laptop this time and I was thinking maybe a Macbook could fit.

 

I'm not a Mac user and I know I'll need some time to adapt myself so I wanted to know if they were some "Mac"corians (Mouwahahah lel so proud of this one) who could tip me a bit on different kind of things Mac related?

 

- The first thing I wanted to know is how to format your Mac? Is Apple giving you the control on that? Can I format OS X Yosemite for a new start? How things work on this side as there is no DVD drive? + Can I install all my software on an external Hard Drive?

 

- I tested both Macbook Air and Macbook Pro. To you which one would you pickup compared to my needs?

 

- Looks like a renewal of the Macbook product line will happen around April. Should I wait this date or buy a PC? I've noticed that some new Macbook Air are already slow running Yosemite. /wot

 

- I would like to enjoy my Mac on OS X so I don't want to replace the main OS by Windows or even create a Dual boot. But can I remove or disabled the default App such as iMovie, GarageBand, Numbers and etc.. ?

 

- I've seen you need to copy the App in the Application folder to install it. My question is how to uninstall an App? How the dir work? By example if I install Photoshop on Windows the dir will be C:/Program Files/Adobe/Photoshop. Hows things works on Mac?

 

- Is there a way to pirate software with Mac? Sometime it can save your life.

 

- What is the baddest thing you experienced with your Mac?

 

Like 3 years ago when I was really interested to buy an iMac I'm very skeptical that an Apple computer can fit my need. Need your help. Also don't tell me to better ask an Apple employee: for most of the time they are much more sellers than giving you real tips.

 

Thanks and cheers.

[tomm]

I'm no expert when it comes to macs but

 

I've just started using one at work, for web development it's hands down the best choice, especially if you need to use stuff like photoshop.

 

if you wanna do game dev stuff, then it's obviously PC.

[Izuno]

FWIW:

 

I started building my own PCs before some mapcorians were born.  Always been a PC / windows guy.

 

In July 2006 all the laptops seemed like shit so I bought a Macbook Pro (MBP).  Ran bootcamp with WinXP. Hardware lasted 4 years....it was glorious.

 

In Nov 2010 I bought another MBP to replace the 2006 version.  Bootcamp again...with WinXP again. Amazing results

 

In Nov 2014 (about 4 weeks ago) I bought a retina-MBP (rMBP)...bootcamp again but now with Windows 7.  

http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/macbook-pro?product=MGXC2LL/A&step=config#

Got the 2.8 ghz option.  Also bought an external optical drive to install Win7 OEM (64bit) from a disc. (use whatever PC OS you want).  

 

Then you get both Mac and Windows. Windows under bootcamp, imo, runs better than parallels or whatever other stuff people use to switch.  However, I don't need the Mac side...I need the windows side for various database software I code in...and then the entire reason Microsoft has not gone out of business: Excel.  the Mac version of Excel is nerfed and you can't code VB in it like you can on the windows version.  I run a ton of optimization and data processing code through Excel hooked up to mySQL databases through homebrew web protocols that is simply not possible in Mac Excel.   If it weren't for that I might be a Mac OS user...but then there is the broader selection of games on windows through Steam and shitzles.

 

Just my 2 cents.  Good luck!

[Pampers]

looks like you need an excuse to buy a mac, so

[Thrik]

There's so much to the question that it's virtually impossible to answer conclusively, but I do use an iMac and my opinion is that OS X absolutely shits all over Windows (which I use every day at work) in terms of design, usability, and features. It's just a better operating system and I honestly can't see how anyone could contest that aside from the bias of familiarity. I never need to run Windows apps, but if I want to game I can dual boot into Windows with nothing but Origin, Steam, and Uplay installed within like 15 seconds.

 

With that said, some things might seem weird if you're used to the Windows approach. To a certain extent you need to embrace the change, otherwise it'll drive you mad. I'll try to answer your questions to shed some light on what I mean:

 

1. The default state of a Mac is a fresh installation of OS X. You can factory reset like with a phone or tablet, but if you're looking for a totally bare drive this probably isn't a platform for you.

 

2. Whichever one has a retina screen will probably look far better, I know it does in the case of my iMac. If you're doing design then you really need one of these so that you can adequately produce assets for the retina-style screens (i.e. 4K and above) that will be universal within a few years. But honestly, everything is just so much nicer, especially now that most software caters for such resolution — the support in the Windows world is comparably laughable.

 

3. Buy Apple hardware when it's brand new. New releases are frequent and you'll probably feel pissed off if you end up buying just before one it happens. The price doesn't change until the next release comes out anyway, so the longer you wait the worse value you're getting. Apple hardware generally sells for very good second-hand prices so expect to get decent money back when you want to upgrade.

 

4. There might be some third-party shit that lets you delete the default apps, but in all honesty a lot of the power of OS X is its excellent suite of built-in functionality. If you don't need something, just tuck it away in the app browser — which is OS X's equivalent of the Start Menu and looks just like the home screens in iOS. I was surprised by how useful I found things like iMovie when I wanted to quickly throw together a screen capture or something, using Keynote to open PowerPoint files from work, etc. I see no sensible reason to not keep these around.

 

5. OS X intentionally abstracts this stuff. You're not meant to be browsing through system/app folders, and in fact the OS hides all of these by default. Applications are meant to provide their own ways of getting into a folder if this is needed. You can do it, but this is really thinking Windows/Linux-style and not getting into the spirit of the better user experience OS X focuses on. Of course you can handle your own stuff however you please in the user data area (i.e. equivalent of Windows' 'My Documents').

 

6. Probably. I don't do it as everything I need is relatively cheap nowadays, even Photoshop.

 

7. How shitty Windows looks on a retina screen.

 

OS X gets particularly sweet if you have an iPhone and/or iPad due to how well connected it all is now. It doesn't sound amazing on paper, but there's just something really elegant and sensible about how everything is completely synced between the three with no effort on your part. You can access any of your Safari tabs from all platforms (they show up as 'tabs on your iPhone' and 'tabs on your iPad'), all of the apps like reminders, notes, etc are synced, you can read/reply to texts on the Mac, see all your mobile photos, access all your contacts, make calls, etc.

[Seldoon182]

I'm no expert when it comes to macs but

 

I've just started using one at work, for web development it's hands down the best choice, especially if you need to use stuff like photoshop.

 

if you wanna do game dev stuff, then it's obviously PC.

 

Yeah the thing is also that I really want to give a try on Sketch (http://bohemiancoding.com/sketch/) which is available for Mac only. Also OS X is Unix based and less pain in the ass to setup Git and Ruby.

 

 

FWIW:

 

I started building my own PCs before some mapcorians were born.  Always been a PC / windows guy.

 

In July 2006 all the laptops seemed like shit so I bought a Macbook Pro (MBP).  Ran bootcamp with WinXP. Hardware lasted 4 years....it was glorious.

 

In Nov 2010 I bought another MBP to replace the 2006 version.  Bootcamp again...with WinXP again. Amazing results

 

In Nov 2014 (about 4 weeks ago) I bought a retina-MBP (rMBP)...bootcamp again but now with Windows 7.  

http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/macbook-pro?product=MGXC2LL/A&step=config#

Got the 2.8 ghz option.  Also bought an external optical drive to install Win7 OEM (64bit) from a disc. (use whatever PC OS you want).  

 

Then you get both Mac and Windows. Windows under bootcamp, imo, runs better than parallels or whatever other stuff people use to switch.  However, I don't need the Mac side...I need the windows side for various database software I code in...and then the entire reason Microsoft has not gone out of business: Excel.  the Mac version of Excel is nerfed and you can't code VB in it like you can on the windows version.  I run a ton of optimization and data processing code through Excel hooked up to mySQL databases through homebrew web protocols that is simply not possible in Mac Excel.   If it weren't for that I might be a Mac OS user...but then there is the broader selection of games on windows through Steam and shitzles.

 

Just my 2 cents.  Good luck!

 

Thanks but I really want to try the Mac part.

 

 

There's so much to the question that it's virtually impossible to answer conclusively, but I do use an iMac and my opinion is that OS X absolutely shits all over Windows (which I use every day at work) in terms of design, usability, and features. It's just a better operating system and I honestly can't see how anyone could contest that aside from the bias of familiarity. I never need to run Windows apps, but if I want to game I can dual boot into Windows with nothing but Origin, Steam, and Uplay installed within like 15 seconds.

 

To me both Windows and OS X sucks compared to the security of some Linux distribution like Tails (https://tails.boum.org/index.en.html). But you can't do both code and design using Linux. (The Gimp suck so hard)

 

 

With that said, some things might seem weird if you're used to the Windows approach. To a certain extent you need to embrace the change, otherwise it'll drive you mad. I'll try to answer your questions to shed some light on what I mean:

 

I think you understand me. I really want to embrace the change! ^^

 

 

1. The default state of a Mac is a fresh installation of OS X. You can factory reset like with a phone or tablet, but if you're looking for a totally bare drive this probably isn't a platform for you.

 

Thanks I've looked for some videos on Youtube. Very simple to do. Can you encrypt your macbook hdd?

 

 

2. Whichever one has a retina screen will probably look far better, I know it does in the case of my iMac. If you're doing design then you really need one of these so that you can adequately produce assets for the retina-style screens (i.e. 4K and above) that will be universal within a few years. But honestly, everything is just so much nicer, especially now that most software caters for such resolution — the support in the Windows world is comparably laughable.

 

Tested my workflow on a retina display and tbh it's rock! But some tell me that a Macbook Air is sufficient compared to what I want to do (even After Effects). But can't find the retina display option on any Macbook Air.

 

I like how light is the Macbook Air btw.

 

 

3. Buy Apple hardware when it's brand new. New releases are frequent and you'll probably feel pissed off if you end up buying just before one it happens. The price doesn't change until the next release comes out anyway, so the longer you wait the worse value you're getting. Apple hardware generally sells for very good second-hand prices so expect to get decent money back when you want to upgrade.

 

I heard Apple will update the Notebook line April 2015 but I need to buy a computer this mouth!

 

 

4. There might be some third-party shit that lets you delete the default apps, but in all honesty a lot of the power of OS X is its excellent suite of built-in functionality. If you don't need something, just tuck it away in the app browser — which is OS X's equivalent of the Start Menu and looks just like the home screens in iOS. I was surprised by how useful I found things like iMovie when I wanted to quickly throw together a screen capture or something, using Keynote to open PowerPoint files from work, etc. I see no sensible reason to not keep these around.

 

I really don't give a shit about Numbers and such. I use Libre Office instead. Btw I've found a useful App on Mac which automatically capture and upload your screenshot in the cloud with one button press. 

 

 

5. OS X intentionally abstracts this stuff. You're not meant to be browsing through system/app folders, and in fact the OS hides all of these by default. Applications are meant to provide their own ways of getting into a folder if this is needed. You can do it, but this is really thinking Windows/Linux-style and not getting into the spirit of the better user experience OS X focuses on. Of course you can handle your own stuff however you please in the user data area (i.e. equivalent of Windows' 'My Documents').

 

The better UX imo is when you get fully control over your device. I want to learn the console and stuff like that!

 

 

OS X gets particularly sweet if you have an iPhone and/or iPad due to how well connected it all is now. It doesn't sound amazing on paper, but there's just something really elegant and sensible about how everything is completely synced between the three with no effort on your part. You can access any of your Safari tabs from all platforms (they show up as 'tabs on your iPhone' and 'tabs on your iPad'), all of the apps like reminders, notes, etc are synced, you can read/reply to texts on the Mac, see all your mobile photos, access all your contacts, make calls, etc.

 

I don't feel the same. It's pretty shitty just in order to plug a single HDMI cable to your TV. Need to enable bullshit toggle button there and there in the settings to turn off the sound on the Mac and keep it on with your TV. Also you can't close the shiny screen of your Mac while watching a Movie when plugged to your TV: You need to spend 200 bucks to buy an Apple TV (which cost 2 bucks in the real life or any Chinese retail online). Also you need to update your printer as you update your Operating System. By example if you can't find any drivers for your printer on Yosemite then you need to buy a new one.

 

As said below there is advantage and inconvenient owning an Apple computer. I'll give a glance tomorrow and see if the blue shirt guy have nuts.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Seldoon182

[blackdog]

Go Mac

Capisc?

[DrywallDreams]

I don't feel the same. It's pretty shitty just in order to plug a single HDMI cable to your TV. Need to enable bullshit toggle button there and there in the settings to turn off the sound on the Mac and keep it on with your TV. Also you can't close the shiny screen of your Mac while watching a Movie when plugged to your TV: You need to spend 200 bucks to buy an Apple TV (which cost 2 bucks in the real life or any Chinese retail online). Also you need to update your printer as you update your Operating System. By example if you can't find any drivers for your printer on Yosemite then you need to buy a new one.

After the first time you change sound settings, they stick (ie turn it on HDMI, outputs to HDMI when present).  Also, if you're charging the laptop, it will still output to hdmi and such (that or you need a mouse or keyboard, not too sure).  

 

I'd go for a MacBook Pro if I were you.

[blackdog]

Seriously tho, as far as laptops go, MacBooks are the best. Imo. (And also according to loads of magazines.)

Also you already have an iPhone.

I think it's ideal for web development, as you can easily dual boot and emulate Windows for your cross browsing tests.

OSX UI is so much better, like Thrik said, denying that can only be bias or not knowing it… it's the system with the most shortcuts(?) and the Trackpad, goddamn, even if you were stuck with my 2008 MacBook that only has two-fingers scrolling you couldn't go back.

MBP or Air… depends how much you're gonna be on the road, and coding on a 13" is a pain.

Also: Airs are not yet Retina, so I'd wait for that if that was your final choice.

Personally I want to move to an Air, but only because I envision a setup where I have a workstation as well, using the Air only for personal stuff or light productivity (like web dev) but hooked to a large screen. In your situation a MBP seems more suitable.

Contrary to widespread opinion, I would like to say that PS on Windows is better. I've been using PS from version 4 to CS5 and on the Mac it was never as optimised; I've read that they put remedy to that in CS6 and CC, but still productivity… there is no ALT+letterkey to open drop down menus (across all OSX), so you spend a lot more seconds per every action when you need to drill down.

Anyway PS is not really a design tool so… skip it as much as possible.

Unfortunately I'm not up to date with the latest OS versions so dunno about formatting etc, but you can connect USB drives and easily boot from an external drive as well.

As for removing software, you just delete apps by default. Bigger suites and sw like PS come with uninstallers. I use AppCleaner for all the rest, cos it will remove extra data files (registry like).

I'm pretty sure you can delete iLife/iWork sw like anything else.

[blackdog]

Also you can't close the shiny screen of your Mac while watching a Movie when plugged to your TV:

BS?

Apple TV costs 79£/99$ or something like that… and you could always get a ChromeCast.

But anyway when you reduce luminosity to the minimum, MacBook's screens do turn off. Or simply press CTRL+SHIFT+Eject. Also MacBooks can operate from a closed lid when hooked up to external display: you need to have a keyboard plugged in and not sure if you need to be plugged to power socket as well.

When you work in multi screen you can drag screens in the settings to position the external left/right/above and also drag the menubar to the second screen if that's gonna be the primary.

[AlexM]

I love the macbook air clone I got (Asus zenbook). It's way cheaper but unfortunately it has one fatal flaw. That UEFI stuff that makes installing linux a huge pain. 

 

People tell me it's just a security thing but the end result is that I have a windows 8 laptop that's almost impossible to install linux on. If macbook airs are still able to easily install windows and linux I might almost buy one if it werent for the terrible markup. 

 

Are macbooks really the only solution to easy tri-os installations these days? 

[DrywallDreams]

I love the macbook air clone I got (Asus zenbook). It's way cheaper but unfortunately it has one fatal flaw. That UEFI stuff that makes installing linux a huge pain. 

 

People tell me it's just a security thing but the end result is that I have a windows 8 laptop that's almost impossible to install linux on. If macbook airs are still able to easily install windows and linux I might almost buy one if it werent for the terrible markup. 

 

Are macbooks really the only solution to easy tri-os installations these days? 

Don't most Linux distros ship with secure builds now though?  I thought we were past the whole UEFI secure deal now.

 

Yeah, a Mac is probably your best bet for tri-os.  Isn't hackintosh rather difficult to get up and running?

[Taylor Swift]

i like mac and cheese

[blackdog]

Ad far as I know there are/were some sure configs for putting together a hackintosh PC, but laptops I dunno. Also dunno if there are new problems with the newer OSes.

PS: dunno now, but at the time the first ultrabooks like zenbook and Adamo came out, they were as expensive as an Air. Frankly at 999 dineros I think an Air is good value for what it offers. Are laptop PCs starting to be competitive on the battery side of things? Cos my MacBook with removable battery at 2-3 years old was still getting 6 hrs of work done with no wifi and low screen brightness (I never keep it more than halfway anyway)

Edited December 7, 2014 by blackdog

[AlexM]

 

I love the macbook air clone I got (Asus zenbook). It's way cheaper but unfortunately it has one fatal flaw. That UEFI stuff that makes installing linux a huge pain. 

 

People tell me it's just a security thing but the end result is that I have a windows 8 laptop that's almost impossible to install linux on. If macbook airs are still able to easily install windows and linux I might almost buy one if it werent for the terrible markup. 

 

Are macbooks really the only solution to easy tri-os installations these days? 

Don't most Linux distros ship with secure builds now though?  I thought we were past the whole UEFI secure deal now.

 

Yeah, a Mac is probably your best bet for tri-os.  Isn't hackintosh rather difficult to get up and running?

 

 

Are we? I gave up like a year ago. That would be awesome