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Mazy

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TBH, it's valid criticism and definitely stuff you should think about as a LD and env artist. Looking at it from the outside, some design decisions that were made on a fast evolving project can seem strange or non-obvious. Things you wouldn't do when working on something yourself or on your own time. Art wise, it may seem that doing a vista takes more time than doing a road, but under gameplay constraints a vista is much much easier because it fully blocks off the gameplay space and solves a lot of potential issues on a game that has characters that can fly or climb up walls.

Route66 did actually at some point make more sense layout wise, as the warehouse started out as a tunnel. with another open end at the final point. You can still see this in Nick Carver's concept art here: nick-carver-route66endpoint02.jpg?151194

This was the original end of the map, and I even had a vista blocked out for it, with a road going off into the distance. However, the map had gameplay problems and design felt the player spawn should be behind the capture point, so we changed that part. At this point we were close to the deadline so it wasn't possible to go back and change another part of the map to fix it up. Going back and changing something that is already art-finished is a big cost in game dev, especially if it potentially opens up a bunch of other issues that will then need more play testing. At this point, people already liked the map, and ultimately gameplay comes first so you can only do so much as an artist trying to make things make sense.

There's a story like this for pretty much every overwatch map :)

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OFC it's a valid criticism, it's just his way of developing his point that makes him looks overly pretentious, each game has its own flaw, balancing gameplay and art has never been an easy task, especially when there's a huge time constrains behind it, and I think Overwatch is doing a great job at it, now ofc I always thought route 66 never really made any sense, but look at Badwater for example, its layout make no sense at all either, yet it's one of the best map ever created imo.

Gameplay > Art > Logic.

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6 minutes ago, RaVaGe said:

OFC it's a valid criticism, it's just his way of developing his point that makes him looks overly pretentious, each game has its own flaw, balancing gameplay and art has never been an easy task, especially when there's a huge time constrains behind it, and I think Overwatch is doing a great job at it, now ofc I always thought route 66 never really made any sense, but look at Badwater for example, its layout make no sense at all either, yet it's one of the best map ever created imo.

Gameplay > Art > Logic.

Fair enough, but badwater is a tf2 map, tf2 doesn't take it self seriously, its absurdist. Overwatch is supposed to be grounded in reality, no matter how much science fantasy they throw at it, its not parody of the real world, it meant to be an idealistic future. I appreciate @Pericolos0 going into detail into how such a visual error occurred and the process they went through making Route 66.

Also badwater, like most TF2 maps can get away with the ridiculous nature of the layout because its set in an industrial sprawl, plus it has plenty of inaccessible areas to show off the world around it which helps make it more real despite the absurdist nature of the game.

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@RaVaGe I was going to say that there is some level of hilarity here, because he didn't know they made the map 😂. However I still hold my point that the ld's (or artists I'm not sure which) OVERUSE the fuck outta roads as lanes. This isn't what they meant when they said 3 lane map:

 Image result for 3 lane road

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23 hours ago, [HP] said:

Havana is now on live :)

 

 

It’s been a good minute since I loaded up Overwatch but I think it’s time to check out the last couple levels I’ve missed, this and Paris look absolutely beautiful!

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