CS:GO - de_tivoli

[osKo]

Current Layout

 

 

The darker blue outlines signify an underpass-like tunnel. Please criticize as much as possible.

 

Layout 3

In the latest version, the railings at A are boarded up, cat is faster to get to, there's an alternate flanking route at B, a door is removed at A to reduce craziness, and the dreaded cement mixer has been removed. Detail is also improved.

 

Layout 4

Major changes to mid, several changes to Long B and T spawn, tunnels at A changed, some suggestions by jackophant added. Detail is also improved.

 

Download layout #1: https://www.dropbox....pdated.zip?dl=0 Hosted 28.09.14

Download layout #2: https://www.dropbox.....10.14.zip?dl=0 Hosted 12.10.14

Download layout #3: https://www.dropbox.com/s/i6er289f2mwwhum/DE_Tivoli%20by%20osKo%20-%20release%203.zip?dl=0 Hosted 19.10.14

Download layout #4: https://www.dropbox.com/s/guy4ee0uo1mx6zp/DE_Tivoli%20by%20osKo%20-%20release%204.zip?dl=0 Pending

Edited October 24, 2014 by osKo

[hamilton5]

game breaking tire in the bottom of skybox...

 

T POV - I thought B was the better site. The long and the mid to B connecter had the same timings - weird concept. A... to many elevations in the back and that cement mixer sucked. don't force me to have to get that headshot - to hard. Overall angles were good, and the layout was super simple. I don't think there are enough good CT positions to play, the few it takes to hold the sites - the rest just rush.

[kinggambit]

I couldn't see any really big issues with the map.

 

B definitely could be more isolated and have more cover; you can guard the bomb from so far away that if the opponent doesn't have a smoke, they're at a huge disadvantage for retakes (nearly impossible against good players). I guess you can argue that it's like a long plant on D2 though. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

For A, the plant area is a bit crammed. Again, I think the site could use more cover to actually provide viable cover to maneuver around (you're sorta pinned down in that small area and don't have many angles to peak opponents from)

 

Lastly, I think that big empty flat space near B is a bit uninspired. Could use something to break up the layout there, even if it barely affects the gameplay. Big part of the reason why I felt I took B so successfully was there's no real place for CT's to defend from (other than from CT spawn, that mid connector route, or that pit cubby on the side).

 

A on the other hand has quite a lot of angles to check, you can't really viably use smokes or flashes, especially with the 2-story landscape. Maybe that's not the issue as much as I think though; there's no real chokepoints to draw that line of scrimmage which lets CT's freely push into T territory. I dunno :x TBH I haven't gone A as much so I can't say for sure.

 

Lastly, just my opinion but that apartment that connects mid and the B route could be streamlined and simplified. It's a bit winding. Maybe add a box below the balcony so players could drop down without focusing on minimizing fall damage.

Edited October 13, 2014 by kinggambit

[osKo]

How's this?

 

I'm not sure if it's a bad or good move on my part — removing that doorway makes it safer for CTs to be in isolation and have more cover, but now it takes longer for terrorists to get to the site if they are choosing to go through the underpass area. However, this opens up more rotation opportunities.

 

 

I also added the crate to stop falling damage on the mid route to B.

 

[tr0nic]

May I suggest blocking off some of the railings in front of the truck so that Terrorists coming from the right (below) feel a bit more secure/ same for cts guarding the middle to A path.  3 openings in the railings? Just some thoughts.

[Parkcityfan]

I like the new A, I felt like there was just a little too much action going on in the old one. I agree with all the points above. However, I feel like Mid needs to be adjusted a little bit with more cover for CTs. It is just too hard to control, with basically three different places they could be. 

[jackophant]

Hey osKo

 

glad to finally see a thread

 

I've drawn over your radar to give you an idea of the changes I would suggest:

 

 

The long red line shows a huuuuuuge sight line that you could probably break up a bit

 

The red scribble boxes show the underground area I meant that offered a lot of weaving backwards and forwards which I felt made it quite maze like and detracted from bombsite A, which I think is a very interesting setup! So let the T's get down the side route and then have a choice to go direct to the bombsite or underground.

 

The green box with arrow is my suggestion of pulling the alternative A route towards T spawn a bit, you could pull the door archway closer, or the entire area, just something will probably help. While the little wall helps Ts get through without too much damage, the route is just very long. The timing as well is unfortunate because Ts can be shot from CTs rushing A and their end of that route and by CTs who sit on their corner of mid.

 

I'd make bombsite B more central, and definitely make it clearer where to plant. I saw most people just plant on the pipework (which as a side note, doesn't look very authentic ) or just run around.

 

Green arrow near B is to suggest another route into B.

 

Purple box suggests moving the B area closer to Ts which actually applies to bomb site A as well. CTs should be closer, but if you time the flashpoints for the start of the round, the CTs engage the Ts on the T side of the bombsite before Ts can even split their attack up to come at different angles.

 

I'm also not entirely sure what purpose the mid apartments serve. You have to run back up mid to enter them, and as a T they take you back to mid (but higher up) or onto the B path where your team will be if they had run from spawn anyway.

 

I don't want this to seem like a negative post, I think both bombsites are great and the map has good potential. It's just a few hitches with how the map flows is all

 

I hope my suggestions make sense, and keep up the good work

[osKo]

Bumped, update 3

[jackophant]

so........................................

 

I enjoyed that map a lot again, but still too many large sight lines and mid is really letting the map down:

 

 

the underground area towards A just lets CTs get behind Ts far too easily, and on a 5v5 (if you ever want your map to be played that way) T's have to dedicate themselves to just one of the routes or risk being spread dangerously thin.

 

I've suggested an alternative for T spawn, but have no idea how to help CT spawn. CT is probably fine, but it seems bad because of the T mid advantage and low ground.

 

The route behind B for CTs is a little unused imo, I only saw it used when a million Ts pushed into CT spawn and couldnt all go the same way.

 

The side route to B in general is a massive sight line which favours aggressive CTs. Maybe use a system like cs_italy where you have the bridge and underpass crossover, which ever way round you like, but one should cross to the alternative route into B. The central bomb site is so much better, but it does need to be made more obvious as to the boundaries of it.

 

Good job

[osKo]

Bumped, update 4

[jackophant]

duuuude, that looks so much better cant wait to play!

 

get some screenshots in? download link?