The Order 1886

[Sprony]

Just going to leave this here:

 

http://gamingbolt.com/pachter-the-order-1886-could-sell-5-million-by-2015-end-10-12-million-if-sony-opts-for-a-ps4-bundle

 

Ouch....

[Taylor]

All you people complaining about the gameplay need to remember that gameplay is just a necessary evil in a videogame.

 

[Erratic]

The Order introduces about as many new things as the last of us (so none) and with a far better developed world and characters but instead of free form stealth gameplay it's just a straight up cover shooter. But how would you know this when everyone on the internet who doesn't know shit about shit or play anything is taking the piss out of it.

 

People get really myopic about gameplay arguments and can't appreciate things when they do something well. This isn't call of duty where you have a linear scripted story focused game that is absolutely fucking stupid from top to bottom. This is well crafted world building with a coherent narrative.

 

I kept thinking of the last of us when playing it because they're very similar in pacing and the only major difference structurally is the length. One is a longer game, so immediately the value police are stripped of their excuse to shit all over it because 'at least it's 12 hours long'. Trim down The Last of Us to something closer to The Order and I'm not sure what the gaping philosophical design differences are between the two games. Somehow this wasn't a problem last year when The last of us won every award imaginable. Or Max Payne 15 years ago as a single player game with no extended content, or Bioshock: Infinite with its supremely confusing mess of a narrative.

 

Modern AAA games aren't about interactivity or discovery or player agency and they haven't been for sometime. 

 

[Izuno]

Erratic I have to say that there are some very fundamentally flawed issues with the gameplay, forget about the length. A stellar 5 hour game is worth more to me than a pisspour 10 or 20 hour game.  Examples in The Order that really dragged on the game:

 

1) The cover system is not fun.  In a cover shooter, moving in and out of cover should feel crisp and strategic. In this game your field of view often makes it hard to see enemies in moments where it did not make sense.  The level design also contributed to this.  And yes, while the levels were detailed and visually impressive (if you can forgive the grey...which I can) but the design was mostly uninspired

 

2) The QTEs were a poor implementation of QTEs.  eh..spoiler but like any of you at this point care:

On the airship mission when you are "stealthing" and have to murder some innocent guards you have to do a simple QTE of hitting the triangle button at he right moment. Except it wasn't exactly clear when to tap the button.  Sure, I got over this, but it felt like a stupid minigame for the sake of it that added very little.

 I'm sorry I'm not more articulate than this, but with all the investment in the visuals and the animations (which often were fantastic) you think they could have made some more/better animations tied to these QTEs with more variety, or ... (read #3 below)

 

3) ...they could have put more thinking into the level design and cover/stealth mechanics.  I mean, if you have the ability to make your levels look that good, couldn't you have put more into that?  I'm over 2/3 through the game (i think) and keep asking myself "how did it come to this?"

 

tl;dr: the made a visually impressive game with quality voice acting, a great setting and interesting concept but just blew it on the gameplay.  Comparing this to Last of Us is bullocks...this game has nothing on Last of Us.  

 

Sorry for the rant.  Obviously this is my opinion and believe me, I really want to like this game more than I do.  I'm bummed and feel bad for Ready at Dawn if sales fail to meet expectations. Making games ain't easy...

[blackdog]

Just going to leave this here:

http://gamingbolt.com/pachter-the-order-1886-could-sell-5-million-by-2015-end-10-12-million-if-sony-opts-for-a-ps4-bundle

That's what I said a few posts back: it's a game good for bundles, should have been in the opening lineup.

[Erratic]

The Last of Us is a better designed game but what I'm saying is structurally they are no different, length aside. Which is what people are primarily taking aim at. Cutscene interruption, QTE's, walk and talk sequences, all of these guide both games through their narrative between the core gameplay segments. It just seems every now and then a game has to be taken to task and it's unfortunate because it means people are basically selective and inconsistent about what they like and when.

 

As for the cover combat and QTE implementation specifically I'm not sure either is done poorly relative to other games. The shooting mechanics are actually pretty refined, if mostly standard. Solid weapon feedback and enemy hit reacts. AI move around the environments nicely and create some decent combat situations. The location specific dialogue call outs are always a nice touch. QTE's are what they are, not sure how they're particularly bad here.

 

If you're going to shit on The Order as 'all the things wrong with the industry' then you need to revisit some previously acclaimed titles. They are no different from each other.

[blackdog]

Erratic, I think that people where hoping for the secret touch that wasn't shown in previews, at least that's my understanding from the other down I've read and discussed about this game.

I was pretty excited at the announcement of this game, and I mean when Pessino was interviewed by an Italian magazine more than a year before they showed the first trailer. When that came out I was disappointed, not by the quality, but because it was already clear what game it would have been. But magazines pushed the "incredible physics response" shown at closed doors tech demos… and people wanted to believe that something new like the gravity gun was coming.

I agree that people are being a bit unfair, but how they've been lead on?

5 hrs is quite outrageous at full price, although I'm sure it'd take more time for me.

As for cutscenes, hope you're referring to Max Payne 3 for your comparison, there they were definitely interrupting too much, while previous games I think were balanced.

[Izuno]

I can agree that structurally Last of Us and The Order are similar. I'm not criticizing The Order for that (or in retrospect The Last of Us). My problem with the order is the execution.  What I mean is this:

 

- While the general voice acting in The Order is high quality, the characters aren't as interesting as in the The Last of Us.  The Last of Us took an early punch at making us feel something and backed it up with an interesting, complex and not always likeable playable character.  The Order just has drabness as it's main emotion.  The Last of Us has a broader range that works well with the material. 

 

- Both The Order does and Last of Us are linear. However TLOU had more variation in the specific paths with more strategic gameplay.  It was more of a mental challenge not unlike a setpiece in a Batman Arkham game where were generally very good.  In The Order the fun comes down to how enjoyable the cover shooting was which feels very bland.  If one finds Batman or TLOU stealthy/limited resources combat scenarios stupid, then nothing I can say to that but I loved the gameplay in those games.  In The Order the cover combat is clunkly and it gets in the way of enjoying it.

 

- as for the cutscenes, TLOU has some long ones but they always seemed to hold my interest more than The Order's cutscenes. Maybe it's just the other drabness that's dragging it down but it's also that I felt more personally connected to the characters in TLOU which goes a very long way.

 

After all this, I'm probably 3/4 through The Order and I do plan to finish it simply because I'm finding it enjoyable enough and it's not at all horrible...just it isn't what I hoped it would be.  This isn't the first PS4 or XBO era game to have that problem.

[Taylor]

I can't say I've been excited by the gameplay of a "blockbuster" AAA for a long time. I do feel with The Order that a lot of the coverage and response before it was released was pretty negative and it was going to have to be extra special to break this preconception. I do know that a few of my friends who've played it have said the reviews are much too negative. It's by the numbers but it's not bad.

Edited February 23, 2015 by Taylor

[Steppenwolf]

The Order and to some extend Evolve also are the sacrificial lambs for all the AAA disappointments that happend in recent times and the loss of influence that review scores and metacritc has over players. It sucks for them but i welcome that reviewers try to bring their scores more in line with player opinion. I hope it stays that way and helps to counter some of the trends in AAA. We have now crossed a line where big budget and hype alone are not enough anymore for games to receive 9's and 10's by default. That's a good thing.

[Sprony]

On 23-2-2015 at 9:05 PM, Steppenwolf said:

The Order and to some extend Evolve also are the sacrificial lambs for all the AAA disappointments that happend in recent times and the loss of influence that review scores and metacritc has over players. It sucks for them but i welcome that reviewers try to bring their scores more in line with player opinion. I hope it stays that way and helps to counter some of the trends in AAA. We have now crossed a line where big budget and hype alone are not enough anymore for games to receive 9's and 10's by default. That's a good thing.

Steppen doesn't say a lot, but when he does, it's pure wisdom and truth.

[Steppenwolf]

It's not completely my own thoughts. Kind of a summary of what i read in a blog post. But it's true. Imo for AAA it will be important that the games give the players a better bang for the buck feel again. The DLC policies really start to hurt. I have nothing against DLC when it's a surprise and comes as an addition for when you've finished the game but right now with day one DLC's, season passes, microtransactions it feels more and more like puzzle pieces that need to be purchased in order to get the full game. That's obscene given that you already paid 60-70 bucks for the "full game".

 

The Order suffers from a different problem aswell that it tries to be a cinematic experience. But why does a few hours of cinematic experience on PS4 cost 3-4 times as much as a newly released movie on bluray? That's difficult to convey to the customer and the backlash is justified in that regard. Of course it's different in that games don't make money on the box office but when you can't compete with similar price for similar entainment value then perhaps it was a bad idea to begin with from an economic point of view.

[El Moroes]

I know it's more about art but, look at these awesome works guys :

 

• https://www.artstation.com/artist/jlef 

 

• https://www.artstation.com/artist/nestorcarpintero

 

• https://www.artstation.com/artist/budlong

 

• https://www.artstation.com/artist/bobbyjrice

 

Example of what you'll see in these pages :

 

 

   

[Mazy]

Aye, looks incredible, that's pretty much the only reason why I wanna try it out. Kinda the same reason why I quite enjoyed AC:Unity, wasn't a particularly good game, but it looked so damn good that it actually made it a worthwhile experience for me.

[-HP-]

Aye, I'm on vacation but ordered this right now so I can play it when I get home. Even tho, at first glance the gameplay looks kinda bare, the art looks really tasty!!