Need some advice, where do I start?

[Nerve]

Thanks guys 

 

Spronyvan/Puddy, just out of interest, how much time per day did you spend learning? I'm working full time, so I'm trying to put a few hours in every evening and then more on the weekend.

 

Going by what people have said, University isn't the best option, so I'm hoping this way I'll still be able to land a job in the future (maybe sooner than I would if I'd had to wait to graduate) and I can save in the meantime.

Edited November 25, 2013 by Nerve

[Alf-Life]

I would say that the main benefits of Uni are the social "having a university life", the deadlines; forcing you to learn and finish something, and the paper; if you would like to move to say the US in the future, having a degree will help.

 

However, if you already had a taste of that life (or don't feel you would miss it), have enough motivation without needing deadlines, and acquire enough talent to move abroad through your talent/portfolio... then I would actually suggest not going back to Uni at that age and incurring debt.

 

Completely up to you, but I would actually advise you to get your foot in the door in QA (quality assurance, testing) right now... and learn level design in your spare time. It's similar to keeping your current job and learning/building up a portfolio in your spare time EXCEPT that you'll have daily contact with talented and inspiring individuals that (hopefully) will motivate you, you'll see the company from the inside and will be able to see if you really want to be a 3D Artist, or a Level Designer, or a Environment Artist or a Scripter. You'll play a bunch of levels that are broken and learn what not to do. Your networking will include more useful contacts than people you meet at University. You might even get promoted within the company into the Design or Art departments after earning your stripes.

[Nerve]

Isn't it difficult to get into QA for Games when you have no prior experience?

[Alf-Life]

It's probably the 'least difficult' way to get into Games without prior experience (or a portfolio, showreel or game demo).

[Nerve]

I'll make sure to check for QA positions regularly then. I have previous QA Lead experience at a software company but I wasn't sure if a games studio would even consider that relevant. Thanks for the comments though, if you have any advice for someone applying for QA positions please do tell

[Puddy]

I have previous QA Lead experience at a software company but I wasn't sure if a games studio would even consider that relevant.

 

?!?!?!?!?!?!? WHY THE FUCK NOT?! Get applying son!

 

Spronyvan/Puddy, just out of interest, how much time per day did you spend learning? I'm working full time, so I'm trying to put a few hours in every evening and then more on the weekend.

 

Well, I got a full time industry job now, so I don't feel the need to focus on learning (beyond business hours). But when I was working intensely on projects for my folio I would spend between 1-4 hours every weekday and up to 10 hours per day during weekends.

[Nerve]

 

I have previous QA Lead experience at a software company but I wasn't sure if a games studio would even consider that relevant.

 

?!?!?!?!?!?!? WHY THE FUCK NOT?! Get applying son!

 

 

I don't know 

 

 

Spronyvan/Puddy, just out of interest, how much time per day did you spend learning? I'm working full time, so I'm trying to put a few hours in every evening and then more on the weekend.

 

Well, I got a full time industry job now, so I don't feel the need to focus on learning (beyond business hours). But when I was working intensely on projects for my folio I would spend between 1-4 hours every weekday and up to 10 hours per day during weekends.

 

 

I'm hoping to be able to stick to something similar. I'm getting to grips with Hammer at the moment and then I'll hopefully be able to start working on something in a few weeks once I feel comfortable.

[Chimeray]

I have to disagree and say QA is probably one of the worst ways of getting any job at a studio other than QA. Sure it gets your foot in the industry and you get to see a little bit of inside stuff but it's ridiculously hard to climb up to a different department. This heavily depends on the company of course and I can only speak for the company I've worked for.

 

1st of there's the social stigma you'll have to overcome. QA is not held in high regard unfortunately and is often staffed by incompetent people. I've seen my fair share of awesome QA people though that are pro-active and super good at their job. But all too often it's a low paying job given to some kid that likes playing games all day long. Not someone that actually cares about user experience and such. I hope the industry will start respecting and staffing the position more properly in the future. When done right it's super important and I value it a lot, it shouldn't have to be like this.

 

So that being said people will be a bit more skeptical when they hear you wanna climb up to a creative position and might scrutinize your portfolio more heavily. Sad but true. So expect having to switch to a different company for a 3D or level design position once you get the hang of things. QA experience still looks good on a resume though, if the portfolio is up to snuff.

 

 

So take that with a pinch of salt. It might work or not depending on the company, usually the bigger the studio the more fragmented departments are and the less you'll actually be in contact with designers and artists.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Chimeray

[Puddy]

Written by a guy from DICE, liked by a guy from DICE, lmao. I actually applied for QA at DICE waaaay back. I got the evilest look when I said I was into level design.

 

But what you write can be true Chimeray, it mostly depends on the company. Either way I think that you have to have a good folio to move up, you'll never get promoted to "become" a level designer or artist. You must already be one.

[Nerve]

Either way, surely it's better to be working in a related field such as QA and working on a portfolio for a couple years than it is to be working in a completely unrelated field before I start applying?

[Chimeray]

@Puddy

Look at it from this perspective: You are a QA lead/manager and interviewing someone for a QA job. First thing your applicant says is that he wants to move up to level design or 3D art... You really wanna fill up your QA spot with such a person?

 

That sounds pretty much the same to me as interviewing someone for a junior position and first thing he says is that he wants to be a lead in the next year. People interview someone to fill a specific job, for instance making level 2 and 3 for game X cos that's what is needed atm, they don't need another lead. They want you to focus on your job and be passionate about it.

 

Sure ambition is good but if it involves switching careers or climbing so fast you'll be unfit (too costly) to do the job that is open then why would you want to hire this person? Obviously it's expected that people move around and ease into different fields over time but don't expect your interviewer to be stoked about you saying you only wanna do this for about a year or something before you move to what you really wanna do. It's kind of insulting to the person that's interviewing you cos he/she is likely very passionate about the kind of job you're being interviewed for and you just wanna use the system.

 

QA is not supposed to be a springboard to other jobs. We need passionate people in those spots. Don't apply if your ambition is something other than QA, that just contributes to the problem.

 

Not saying this is you Puddy, just wanted to throw some perspective onto this whole QA debacle Or at least my viewpoint on it.

 

@Nerve. Sure. You already have some QA experience in a different field so sounds like you'd be a good fit.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Chimeray

[Puddy]

@Chimeray: Yup, I know all that. I was asked about design and didn't feel like lying. Didn't gloat about it lol. At the time I subscribed to the theory that it's best to get a foot in the door, anyway possible and that's why I applied. You have to remember that landing an industry job isn't always that easy. Luckily I got a foot in the door the proper way (full time designer job).

[Sigma]

I am speaking with an educational institution currently regarding this very matter Puddy, trying to find out where I fit in and my best course of action. My theory is if you can find a cheaper source of educational information to utilize, do so. Just be aware that it does not mean your end product will be better (nor does having the more costly university type education guarantee that). I live in the USA, and because of the economy and cost of education here I am doubling down and also pursuing a master's degree in a business related field while trying to find any entry level/junior level internships/jobs here as well. I work full time so creating a beautiful portfolio in a short time frame is difficult. My theory to get into the industry is to come at it from the business side of things but than I enjoy that side just as much as the art side. So... take it with a grain of salt as I'm not there yet. But I feel the pain buddy.

[PogoP]

Nobody goes into an interview and says 'I wanna be the lead artist in one year's time', you keep that shit to yourself. Say you're into level design or whatever, and you'll come across as passionate. But you're still gonna do your job properly...

[FrieChamp]

I know at least 4 guys who used to do QA at Crytek and now work in Design positions. They learned what worked and what didn't (as in "what makes a map/game fun") during the testing process, used down-time & spare-time to work on maps, contributed to community map-packs and proved their capabilites & work ethic that way. It's harder to find a designer who's familiar with the game(s), engine & tools than to replace that guy's seat with a new tester. I'm sure there are differences between studios, and, needless to say, if you're a lousy tester, you won't last enough, but it happens more often than you might think.