Campaignjunkie

PS where is campaignjunkie I want to poke fun at him.

Sorry for cluttering this thread; I'll make this quick.

Screw you, Benny-boy!

Yay ferret!

Blaz, you have to up the light intensity a lot more (the 4th "Brightness" number) in Source a lot higher than what you had in HL1. I commonly have lights at 1500+ intensity depending on the size of the room. There's also lots of controls for light falloff and sharpness -

"constant" dims the area around the light but brightens the spotlight target area. Valve used high constants (~2000+) for those Combine spotlights.

"quadratic" brightens the area directly around the light, but decreases the distance the light will travel.

"linear" dims all of the light.

... and that's it for my crash course in Source lighting. Refer to the better resource over here: http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Light

Uhh it says "Torque" in the screenshot... if I'm not mistaken.

I'm doing some style tests with the textures right now to get a feel for them. Here's a hallway. It's nothing special and I'm not too happy with how the light turned out, but I just wanted to show that someone was using these textures and loving them.

EDIT: Oops, forgot to link the picture...

There's a 3000 car video too, but in my opinion it's not as "fun" as this 1K one.

Speaking of porting to other games... Could I port these to Source, Blaz? I really want to make a map with them.

Have you tried fiddling with the spawn flags?

http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki ... sics#Flags

Maybe "Start Asleep" or something like that?

It's short, but there's a bit of replay value if you try out different skills and approaches. Supposedly you can noclip around a trigger and actually fight the ogre at the end, though I haven't tried personally.

Anyway, I really liked it. The combat is a lot more visceral than Oblivion, which I already liked in the first place. It definitely has a crazy action-movie feel to it; kicking people off ledges, swinging around on chains, etc. It reminds me of the fights in Pirates of the Carribean movies. The level design also feels really really contrived (convenient wooden platforms, lots of physics props) but that's forgivable.

A cool thing I discovered: You can set your arrows on fire if you draw your bow and hold the arrow to a torch.

A cool moment I had: I was trying to snipe this one orc with a bow and arrow - but I missed and hit a rope, which caused a chandelier to drop down and break the wood platform he was standing on. It was a long fall to the bottom.

The stealth is a little weaker than I would like, and the story already seems really lame - but the combat! Oh, the combat! I'm definitely looking forward to this now.

Yeah, I'm getting this problem too, and I don't really have any solution for the prop duplication. Have you guys contacted Valve about it?

Staying with HL1 wasn't much of an option either. We/They were hemorrhaging staff like crazy, and no one wanted to work with old tech anymore (except some of the mappers) I think it's very easy to say "they should have stuck with HL1" but that wasn't very realistic either. Dead either way, except there was a hope for new life in Source that never came to pass.

I bought it. I'm liking it so far. If you find a good 8 person server, the game really shines. However, if there are a couple idiots who complain about not knowing what to do, then obviously it doesn't work as well. Here are my 2 cents:

- The maps are really boxy. Reno, you better fix this! It reminds me of something in Prince of Persia: Sands of Time. Those designers made a point to get rid of virtually every straight edge, which I think would work better for the Ship maps as well.

- In a game where it's absolutely necessary to memorize maps, the maps are difficult to learn. There are some very convoluted layouts (probably on purpose, so you can avoid your hunter and such, but it's still difficult to learn) and since most of the game takes place in hallways, there's not many landmarks to help you navigate. The compass KIND of helps, but not that much. Some kind of toggle-able automap would be better.

- I really like the music though. Maybe it's just me.

- The bots are smarter than I expected. Sometimes they seem really human in their mannerisms - sometimes they're dumb as nails.

Oh, I just remembered - Grandia 2, if you're into RPGs. The story is somewhat mediocre and the characters aren't exactly memorable, but the fights are excellent. I remember purposely attacking monsters just to fight again - it was that good.

Skies of Arcadia is good too. Kind of repetitive at times, but entertaining for the most part.

Dreamcast - the last console I bought. T'was awesome.

- Jet Grind Radio (it had an inferior sequel on X-Box called Jet Set Radio Future, the original on DC is much much better - definitely my favorite DC game)

- Ikagara (sp?) (top down shooter, really cool)

- Samba de Amigo (only if you can find the maraca controllers!)

- Power Stone, Power Stone 2 (fantastic game for parties)

- Marvel vs. Capcom 2

- Dynamite Cop (Streets of Rage-style arcade game, spiritual successor to Die Hard Arcade. Super awesome.)

Oh man. Could I convert those to Source when you're done? I really want to make a map with those. As Ferret said - it's NS on crack.

I played the HL1 demo a bit. It was fun... that is, if you knew what to do and had a strategy. Here's how the HL1 gameplay worked, as I saw it:

Every player is assigned another player target to kill. First, you have to find out who he is. To get a player's name, you have to +use them. Once you get their name, you can follow them throughout the ship and eventually kill them. So, you +use them and kill them, real easy right?

The thing is, there are a bunch of AI bots on the ship as well. Most people generally ignore them, because you can usually tell who's a bot and who's a player pretty easily - the bots rarely run, they walk in straight lines, they rarely strafe, etc.

Thus, the challenge actually lies in blending in with these bots, so that your would-be assassin (or possible target) ignores you and assumes you're a bot. You walk in straight lines, you turn really slowly, etc. Human players will make a mistake and run too fast, or turn too quickly - at which point, you carefully trail them back to their cabin... and when they're asleep... POW!

.. While I'm sure there are other play styles, that's what intrigued me when I played it. It's kind of like being a spy in TFC. You have to play towards other player's expectations and deceive them. There's a lot of "player psychology" involved... if you actually play for more than a few minutes instead of judging it solely by the screenshots.

I'm not sure if I would pay for it, though.

It works really well in Oblivion too. When you hit someone, it feels really, uh... "visceral" - plus, there's still plenty of strategy involved with movement and timing your attacks. Anyway, I'm looking forward to this, especially since the developers are big fans of Thief and System Shock.

I think it's the texture tiling that gives it away - in the mountains or in the grass sprites. But then again, I guess that's not really an issue in-game.

Great work, you really captured that whole "vast" feeling, simply in the screenshots alone. I dig the mesa too.

I'd say NS is one of the more successful / iconic implementations, though. I heard that game Savage was supposed to be pretty good too.

I hear SketchUp is quite nice.

[12] hey Campaignjunkie

[12] hello

[12] how are you?

[12] fine, thanks

[12] you know who I am at all?

[12] I wouldn't suppose so

[12] no, unfortunately :\

[12] curious if we've spoken before

[12] ah ok

[12] David Lyon, project manager of Nuclear Dawn

[12] nice to meet you

[12] and you as well

[12] been looking at your site, very nice stuff

[12] thanks

[12] have you seen any Nuclear Dawn media?

[13] yeah, some, just sa74n's subway shots recently

[13] ok cool

[13] well, we're now at a stage we have a game to play, and I'm curious if you fancy coming onboard

[13] not as a die-hard core team member, but rather to build a level layout and work on the gameplay primarily over the course of a few months testing

[13] as we're a multiplayer game

[13] gameplay is hugely important, as levels are replayed time and time again

[13] essentially abused for any flaw

[13] if you are interested, I'll continue

[13] Sorry, I don't fancy multiplayer mapping too much, thanks for the offer though

[13] sure thing

He seemed nice enough to me. But in the face of this overwhelming testimony, I guess I was the exception rather than the usual? No matter what his behavior actually is, I think you guys might be making too big of a deal out of this. He's just a person - not a comic book villain.

With regard to phys props - I think few players are going to go the bathroom just to fetch some sink or toilets. Both bathrooms are death traps; pretty cramped, with only two exits. Sid Meier defines gameplay as "a set of interesting choices" - and this layout doesn't provide much choice.

I understand you want to create an accurate recreation of the pools, but I'm of the opinion that you can have your cake AND eat it too. Realism is just a tool to make maps awesome - I don't think it should be a goal in itself. But clearly... you have other ideas.

I think the layout needs work. I've never been to the baths of course, but if this is the actual layout, it doesn't make for very compelling play. Very linear, one-level play with few height changes or Z-axis gameplay. Not much opportunity for cover either, and only a few phys props (which is where HL2 DM really shines, IMO).

Visually, I also think you can push the map farther. It needs more light contrast, and all the rooms look the same - especially since the layout is mirrored. There's no recognizable landmarks to help the players navigate. Look at the HL2DM source VMFs included with the SDK, see how Valve does some of its stuff.

Some suggestions:

- Ditch the sunset sky, it's generally overused. (I would suggest not using a sky at all, it takes focus away from the interior)

- (Basically a consequence of getting rid of the sunset sky) Ditch the orangeish lighting. I think it looks busy and muddy when it interacts with the blueness of the textures. Of course some people like that, but I don't really care for it.

- Consider making the lamps into prop_physics, to make gameplay more interesting. Plus - If the player can rip radiators off the walls, then why not these lamps? Of course, they won't be able to emit light anymore, but I think the map would be better off with less light everywhere.

- Replace the brush benches with prop_physics benches. It'll look better and make gameplay more interesting.

- There's no signs of use in the level. No dirt, nothing broken, everything is in pristine condition. Add some chairs, stools, towels, dirt, etc. You don't have to demolish the place, but I'm just saying that real-world stuff is rarely in perfect condition.

- Add landmarks - unique bits that will make a certain room stick out. Maybe a fountain or something?

- Showers in the bathroom? For the ones who'd rather not use the baths, huh?

If you'd like, you can send me the VMF and I'll try to help with the lighting and such, or at least voice my opinion.

It's really.. uhh.. blue. So blue infact, that I find it really distracting. Really distracting! How has no one else mentioned this yet? It seems like a really glaring thing that needs improvement... C'mon! I'm not crazy! Stop staring at me! You and your accusing eyes! AHHH!

But seriously, I would tone down the blue to a more earthy saturation. And get some of that fancy specular shader stuff on the tiles, this is Source after all!

EDIT: I'm assuming you're basing the level off of this image ( http://www.carto.net/neumann/travelling ... n_bath.jpg ).. Hmm, tricky. But notice that the blue tiles on the bottom wall trim are more purpleish, while the blue tiles on the walls are less purpleish. Also, the blue on the columns is REALLY desaturated, not nearly as strong as you have it right now. And as the others said, work on getting some natural looking light coming through the windows - in HL2, sometimes Valve just used a pure white texture (I think it's called fakesky or something) and put a window over it. But anyway, this is certainly a good start, keep working on it!